lakemalcom 14 points 7 months ago

As always, reality is more complicated. She voted against the bill. The amendment was worthless anyway.

In a post on X Saturday, Ocasio-Cortez defended her vote against the amendment, writing that Greene’s amendment “does nothing to cut off offensive aid to Israel nor end the flow of US munitions being used in Gaza,” which she suggested she would oppose.

“I have long stated that I do not believe that adding to the death count of innocent victims to this war is constructive to its end. That is a simple and clear difference of opinion that has long been established,” wrote Ocasio-Cortez. “I remain focused on cutting the flow of US munitions that are being used to perpetuate the genocide in Gaza.”

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mrdown 4 points 7 months ago

At least it would have cut the aid for the iron dome which would force israel to spend it own money for it rather thsn american money

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BrainInABox 1 point 7 months ago

Please tell me we're not pretending this "sending anti-air guns to Nazi Germany isn't sending them weapons" reasoning is actually sensible. It doesn't hold up to even the slightest examination and anyone pretending otherwise is nakedly bad faith.

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geneva_convenience -8 points 7 months ago

Stop lying. There is no such thing as "defensive weapons". https://responsiblestatecraft.org/aoc-israel-gaza/

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prole 3 points 7 months ago

What is it that you think the Iron Dome does?

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geneva_convenience 0 points 7 months ago

Allow Israel to kill Palestinians, Lebanese and Iranians with impunity

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prole 4 points 7 months ago

So, the Iron Dome specifically. What does it do? Is it offensive or defensive?

I honestly fucking hate being the person who appears to be defending Israel. I'm not. I'm just tired of this infighting purity test bullshit

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Ensign_Crab 12 points 7 months ago

OP only ever has a problem with progressives.

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Zaktor 4 points 7 months ago

He's incredibly sus.

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TheDemonBuer 11 points 7 months ago

The right has such a huge advantage. All they have to do is sit back and wait for the left to destroy itself through purity tests and infighting.

It's like if two armies met on a battlefield, but instead of fighting each other one of the armies just fought amongst themselves while the other watched.

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frisbird 3 points 7 months ago

The advantage the right has is that people who think they oppose the right are fully engaged in right-supporting activities without realizing it.

The right is not interested in destroying the left, they are interested in advancing their program.

The people who believe in broad left unity don't have a program other than destroying the right. They literally cannot have a program because they are attempting to build a broad coalition instead of a program.

There are leftists attempting to build a program. And the people who think they are leftists (but aren't actually leftists) don't like the program and instead attack the program and argue for defeating the right at all costs.

Here's the problem. There is only one program that will defeat the right - feminist communist decolonialism. That's it. End the European occupation of the Western hemisphere. Dismantle the settler states. Dismantle their militaries. Dismantle their legal frameworks. Dismantle their economies. Strip them of their sovereignty. Abolish private property. Establish rational planning functions.

That's the program. Not "elect genocide apologists with the correct team logo on them". Not "elect millionaire lap dogs wth the correct team logo on them". Not "break up the monopolies to create better companies and more competition". Not "vote for the people who were asleep at the wheel for the last 40 years and couldn't protect us against the rising fascism that everyone saw coming".

Communism. Decolonization. End of patriarchy. End of Eurocentrism. Rematriation from Europe and the settler colonies of centuries of stolen wealth. Demilitarization of the North Atlantic. Reeducation.

That's the program. You're either with the program or you're protecting literally everything that empowers the right and pretending that putting tokenized racial and gender representatives in charge of the baby killing machine is the goal. And if you think that's leftist infighting, you're not the left.

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TheDemonBuer -1 points 7 months ago

There are leftists attempting to build a program. And the people who think they are leftists (but aren't actually leftists) don't like the program and instead attack the program and argue for defeating the right at all costs.

I agree. "Left unity" is a myth. Non-Leftists really need to stop trying to build a coalition with the Left. Leftists are not interested in coalition building, they're only interested in building their program. We non-Leftists need to finally realize this.

...you're not the left.

You're right, I'm not.

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frisbird 3 points 7 months ago

Awesome! Good self awareness.

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Krauerking 1 point 7 months ago

Thats nonsense masquerading as wise wisdom.

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TheDemonBuer 0 points 7 months ago

Oh my god, I am so fucking sick of this conversation. Ok, some leftists want to build a leftist program, some don't. Some want to build a coalition with non-leftists, some don't. Or whatever, who knows, I don't fucking care anymore.

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AntiBullyRanger 0 points 7 months ago

How does the Right do purity tests?

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brucethemoose 5 points 7 months ago

At the moment, in the US, it’s:

“Do you support Donald Trump unconditionally?”

Yes _
No _

My observation is that, in the US, support of the right structurally resembles evangelical Christianity. Or maybe a megachurch. There are exceptions, like single-issue Republican voters over taxes or business things, but a whole lot of it is structured as a communal belief: “are you in our tribe, or are you not?” There’s an imperative for unity and conformance that’s more important than individual issues, hence they tend to consolidate the platform over time.

The US Left, on the other hand, seems more issue focused, and less concerned with consolidation around personalities/beliefs like an evangelical church. But all that self-righteousness is still there. And it’s my belief that social media has brought out the worst of their tendency to swallow ragebait and issue performative purity tests.

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AntiBullyRanger -1 points 7 months ago

Interesting perspective.
But I was getting to a point liberals hate being pointed out.
There is no “US Left.” It's illegal.

So I can see liberals indeed taking a populist approach to solidifying action like evangelicals do, since they are not going to oppose Caesar. Their king is the most authoritarian figure in their belief system, and they will be blessed martyred.

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geneva_convenience 0 points 7 months ago

The right has such a huge advantage. All they have to do is sit back and wait for the left to justify supporting right-wing politicians sending missiles to a genocidal ethnostate

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TheDemonBuer 4 points 7 months ago

And the right wins again. By default.

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AntiBullyRanger 0 points 7 months ago

Into the Nazi List.

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BrainInABox -1 points 7 months ago

This isn't a sports game. People aren't going to support people they fundamentally disagree with just because you think they are on the same "team". Leftists are not your "army" to command, and it's not infighting when people who oppose genocide critise those committing it

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TheDemonBuer 0 points 7 months ago

you think they are on the same "team". Leftists are not your "army" to command

I don't think that. I did think leftists wanted to build a coalition with other groups to take on the far right, but I know better now. Don't worry, I won't make that mistake again.

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BrainInABox -1 points 7 months ago

Good. Glad you learned your lesson. But let's be honest, you never wanted a coalition, you just wanted leftists to be subservient to liberals.

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TheDemonBuer 0 points 7 months ago

But let's be honest, you never wanted a coalition, you just wanted leftists to be subservient to liberals.

That's not true. You can vote however you want, you can advocate for whatever political movement you want and you can try to build the world that you want. That's always been true and that remains true.

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yakko -3 points 7 months ago

Well, that's disappointing

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Gladaed 6 points 7 months ago

Apparently this is misleading. Can't just vote yes on a bill that has a single ineffectual sentence that agrees with you. Us legislative is wild.

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yakko 4 points 7 months ago

I don't have the mental bandwidth for this today, so I'll decline to have an opinion. I've liked AOC up to now, so I'll give benefit of doubt!

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geneva_convenience -1 points 7 months ago

The Feddior is lying.

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geneva_convenience -9 points 7 months ago

She thought she could fence sit a genocide and pretend to have been against it when everyone else realized how wrong she was.

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