Waze will now warn drivers about crash dangers using historical data

3 years ago by ijeff to c/android

The feature combines geographic and traffic data with historical crash data.
Squeak 49 points 3 years ago

Not sure an alert to a history of crashes is great. Now people will take their eyes off the road to read a notification instead of watching the road

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PixTupy 26 points 3 years ago

In my country there's sometimes signs that say something like "caution: accident prone area". I never thought it distracting when driving.

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grue 18 points 3 years ago path: 0 5135622 5138938 5139683, hotness: undefined, score: 18, children: 3
RGB3x3 3 points 3 years ago

Shit, it really feels like his point is spot on. If engineers are trying to design for safety, they're doing a horrible job at it.

I can't think of a single road I've driven down in the US that felt safe for anyone. Too much traffic weaving in and out and through merges and intersections, basically no safe bike lanes, and foot paths so close to fast-moving traffic that you feel like you're in a wind tunnel.

How does something so endemic like this get fixed?

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grue 4 points 3 years ago

How does something so endemic like this get fixed?

That's a very good question. Ultimately, the standards of practice in traffic engineering need to change. Speaking of which: to put a finer point on just how much of an uphill battle that is, consider the fact that even the name itself^1^ -- "traffic engineering" -- is biased towards narrow concern for the routing of cars at the expense of holistic consideration of the street as a place. (See also: confessions #2, #20, and #28) There's a huge amount of institutional inertia supporting the bad status quo, including everything from university curriculum, to standards documents like the AASHTO Green Book and the MUTCD, to the fact that young Engineers-In-Training (EITs) are required to work under existing licensed Professional Engineers (PEs) for about half a decade (it varies depending on circumstances) before being allowed by law to strike out on their own -- which on balance is almost certainly a good thing because we definitely don't want unqualified people stamping plans, but also could lead to being inculcated into old ways of thinking and having latent new urbanist inclinations beaten out of them.

Fun fact: the biggest US traffic engineering research group, one which has an outsize influence in writing those standards documents, is none other than the Texas A&M Transportation Institute (TTI). In Texas. Not that there's anything wrong with that, but yea.

Anyway, one way for non-engineers to try to help that happen faster -- other than bitching about it on social media like I'm doing right now -- would be to educate yourself on New Urbanist/Strong Towns/Fuck Cars/etc. ideas, then get involved with your local politics and lobby for said ideas to be implemented. More concretely, read Jane Jacobs and Shoup and watch a bunch of Not Just Bikes videos, then call up your city councilperson, county commissioner and state rep, join whatever citizen planning groups happen to be around (e.g. my city has "NPUs"), and start bitching at those people about it. You can also go to public hearings for road projects and bitch at the engineers directly (they love that sort of thing, LOL).


^1^ It's a totally different subject -- albeit one I'm also passionate about -- but I like to cite this article as a good demonstration of how framing matters. It really can't just be dismissed as "mere semantics."

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PixTupy 1 point 3 years ago

Oh you'd love our "warning: road in poor condition" signs then. Those always tick me off.

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chaorace 10 points 3 years ago

I present for your consideration the case of September 3rd, 1967: the day Sweden switched from driving on the left side of the road to the right side. One would expect that the incredibly distracting process of overcoming a lifetime of learned habit would be a recipe for chaos, but in fact there were significantly fewer accidents than average on the day of the change [^1].

As it turns out, the danger of complacency outweighs the danger of distraction. It does not particularly matter where one directs their focus if they are not driving mindfully. In a more natural environment, we're good enough at identifying dangerous situations to pay attention when it matters, but roads are not a natural environment. For every alert person briefly annoyed by an audio notification there will be at least as many pedal-pushers too relaxed to even form coherent memories, let alone engage in defensive driving.[^2]

[^1]: The effect was not permanent, so I will be ignoring the alternative explanation that the new side was somehow massively superior to the extent required to explain the discrepancy. Ditto to the idea that fewer people were driving that one particular day, because the effect did last longer than a single day.

[^2]: Of course, just because someone's driving absent-mindedly doesn't mean that they're stupid. They'll catch on if you just buzz their phone randomly because you think it'll prevent crashes. The driver needs to believe that the danger is real which is something that the app has to earn by not being manipulative.

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RGB3x3 2 points 3 years ago

That's a good point. Alerts like that could jolt people back into paying attention, rather than spacing out. It's disappointing that people could think spacing out while traveling 80mph is okay, but that's where we are.

The "accident-likely" alerts are a good thing, imo

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MedicPigBabySaver -2 points 3 years ago

And, instead of safely driving the road conditions, they'll wonder where exactly others have crashed and why?

Definitely an unnecessary distraction. I really think the devs for this app don't drive. They either ride a bike or commute via subway/bus.

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Ottomateeverything 0 points 3 years ago

What do you mean? Is it a bad idea to prompt people driving vehicles moving over 70 mph as to whether there was a speed trap? But then how will the next people know that need to stop speeding for the next couple miles before they can speed again without recourse?

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Psychodelic 9 points 3 years ago

Literally its best feature. Y'all are fuckin buggin

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RGB3x3 1 point 3 years ago

Seriously. Cops sitting to ticket people are essentially just applying an extra tax to fund their departments. Not giving that to them is a good thing.

I've more often seen unsafe driving conditions because of people slowing down to avoid a radar cop than when traffic is flowing predictably and consistently.

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Ottomateeverything 0 points 3 years ago

I really don't understand how this shit is even legal.

"Tell me where I can and can't break laws that were literally put in place so I don't accidentally fucking kill someone".

It's literally built to help people avoid the punishment made to keep people from doing something that's literally dangerous to the people around them.

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snooggums -8 points 3 years ago

I had to turn off the distracting lane assist/warning feature because of so many false positives from inconsistent lane markings, especially in construction zones.

A few warnings is great, too many are so distracting.

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Pretzilla 6 points 3 years ago

That's a Waze feature??

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snooggums -3 points 3 years ago

Just a general comment about excessive false positive warnings.

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dmtalon 44 points 3 years ago

*crashes while reading Waze prompt about crashes

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dan1101 9 points 3 years ago

Exactly. Driving... Driving...BEEP BOOP!...What was that?CRASH!!

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kratoz29 4 points 3 years ago

It works that well.

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XTornado 1 point 3 years ago

It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

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reddig33 19 points 3 years ago

I wonder if just having a color coded indicator bar, or a unique icon that pops up would work better than a text-based alert.

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keyez 3 points 3 years ago

Or coloring the section of the road accordingly just like it does with slowdowns or traffic jams coloring yellow and red for the stretch ahead.

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thisisawayoflife 14 points 3 years ago

Now if only every state did vehicle inspections and enforced the laws...

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grue 8 points 3 years ago

Or better yet, if only engineers did their fucking jobs and fixed negligently-designed areas to be less dangerous.

Edit: I say that as an engineer criticizing my own profession from the inside, by the way.

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thisisawayoflife 2 points 3 years ago
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grue 6 points 3 years ago

Sure, but a lot more crashes are caused by poor design (including design that facilititates law-breaking) than mechanical failures or lack of enforcement.

In particular, I want to address the latter: trying to stop people from speeding by having more police patrols simply doesn't work. The only thing that does work is physically changing the design of the street (narrowing lanes, etc.) to make it scarier and less comfortable for drivers to go too fast. That's the engineers' responsibility, not law enforcement's.

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IzzyScissor 2 points 3 years ago

Seriously - the most dangerous roads I've ever been on were in Texas where there were 12 lane highways, and crazy people who wanted to drive 100MPH past you in the right-hand lane, all while people are merging on and off the highway.

Doing the speed limit meant that EVERYONE was driving faster than you, which meant that you were a lot more likely to get rear-ended from someone who didn't see you in time. You have to speed to stay safe, and then you add in construction zones and it's just a death trap.

Where is our public transportation option?

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thisisawayoflife 2 points 3 years ago
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CAVOK 12 points 3 years ago

Is there any waze alternative based on openstreetmap?

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ntzm 7 points 3 years ago

Magic earth is the best, not open source though

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OsrsNeedsF2P 8 points 3 years ago

This will be amazing. Even if it saves one life (and it will likely save many), it's a very welcome change

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deadcatbounce 2 points 3 years ago

Agreed. Don't understand why people use Google Maps over Waze unless you're not in a car.

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shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit 3 points 3 years ago

I used to use Waze, but got tired of it sending me through back streets and turns to save only a minute - problem was, those slower back streets and waiting at junctions ended up taking longer.

Google Maps on the other hand will offer more sane routes, and only send me down back streets where the saving is more than say 4 or 5minutes.

Also, Waze made my phone HOT!

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deadcatbounce 1 point 3 years ago

I'm sure Waze used to say that where you know better, use your own initiative rather than blindly follow a machine.

There are settings in Waze to turn off the problems that you encountered. Apps change of you're lucky. Maybe I'm wrong about maps today; I try it every now and again. Maps is all I use for public transport and walking.

Loving the last comment: nothing like an app to make an old phone, sparkle like new. 😁

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grue 3 points 3 years ago path: 0 5140023, hotness: undefined, score: 3, children: 1
RGB3x3 2 points 3 years ago

I'm here for the angry advocacy of better road design you're bringing to this post.

Keep it going!

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Summzashi 1 point 3 years ago

Israëli company

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db2 -4 points 3 years ago

Isn't it a little late to alert someone of a crash after it's already a historical fact?

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