Multiple people explaining how phase to earth is fine, ackshualky.

a year ago by Ilovethebomb to c/confidently_incorrect

cross-posted from: https://lemmy.nz/post/28693796

Check the comments of the original post for the stupidity.

For those of you without an electrical background, the diagram shows the protective earth connected directly to phase, with phase and neutral also joined.

Correctly wired, this would be a three pin plug, with the earth wire connected to the earth pin in the plug, with the other end connected to the metal casing of the appliance. This is a critical safety feature, which will cause the circuit protection to trip in the event a phase wire contacts the metal of whatever this is connected to.

If this was actually done, the most likely outcome is it would trip a circuit breaker, but if the neutral was broken, it would connect phase directly to the casing, and likely electrocute someone.

Treczoks 58 points a year ago

It is long overdue that those companies can be held legally responsible for what their AI produces.

If i had drawn up and published such an image, I probably could be drawn in court. Time for AI companies to fall under the same rule.

There have been cases of people poisoned, people looking for psychological help getting recommended to commit suicide, etc.

Time to drag those companies in court.

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Aeri 4 points a year ago

To be fair you are incredibly stupid if you ask this technology to render critical instructions and don't cross-reference it with any actual concrete information.

I do think that these companies should be held responsible for some negative consequences of their actions but people are going to be stupid and hurt themselves no matter what.

path: 0 19622287 19655838, hotness: undefined, score: 4, children: 1

Treczoks -1 points a year ago

They trust something that is hailed to them as the ultimative super brain. They didn't get warned that the service is not a reliable source of information.

If you have to tell your customers not to stick kitchen knifes into children and not to attempt to stop the chainsaws' running chain with your hand, AI-providing services should at least be required to put thick warnings on their pages not to trust their lives. I just bought a kitchen-machine, and it has pages over pages of warnings in them for about things I would not have thought that people would need to be warned of...

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ideonek 39 points a year ago

The day will come when Fuck AI and Confidently Inncorect will have no choice, but to merge into one community.

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MrLLM -1 points a year ago

And then a new literally Fuck AI community will emerge! Or just not, hopefully.

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balsoft 21 points a year ago

If this was actually done, the most likely outcome is it would trip a circuit breaker

Or explode the plug in someone's hand, depending on the circuit breaker and the wire gauge

path: 0 19621702, hotness: undefined, score: 21, children: 7

Ilovethebomb 15 points a year ago

On a domestic plug the chances of injury are low, but not zero. It would definitely damage both the plug and socket, possibly burn your hand, and definitely be an exciting moment.

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balsoft 12 points a year ago

I've had a cheapo electric kettle plug explode in my hand due to melted contacts in the base touching each other (I'm not sure why the plug exploded and not the base, probably a shitty connection in the plug). I didn't get injured but it was indeed quite exciting.

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i_am_not_a_robot 7 points a year ago

I had a cheapo Chinese charger explode in the socket. It was indeed quite exciting.

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Aeri 2 points a year ago

Would you even be able to plug the damn thing in? I've assembled plugs before and I don't think this would work, like at all. One wouldn't even be able to reach the point of failure, typically when you buy plugs to wire up like this just have spots for you to screw in your wires, also I don't think any country has that specific two vertically oriented connector setup.

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Ilovethebomb 1 point a year ago

Apparently not. I'm not familiar with north America plugs, but apparently this isn't right either.

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HejMedDig 8 points a year ago

If done that way, it wouldn't even fit into a socket. Prongs are rotated 90°

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balsoft 3 points a year ago

Huh, yeah, you are right. I'm not from the US so it didn't immediately jump out at me

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FrederikNJS 17 points a year ago

Yeah... I tried to ask it in Danish, and this is what it came up with...

I've assembled a few plugs myself... And this certain isn't quite how I did it...

EDIT: This was actually Gemini 2.5 Pro... But it's not very "pro"

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mysticalone 1 point a year ago

Google should just send gemini to the Google Graveyard(tm)

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JackbyDev 15 points a year ago

This device is useful for exercise. You will need to walk to the panel to flip the fuse every time you use it.

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yourgodlucifer 13 points a year ago

Actually it wouldn't do anything because you would not even be able to plug it in since the prongs are facing the wrong way and therefore would not fit into the socket.

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Ilovethebomb 6 points a year ago

That's also a fair point, I'm not familiar with this particular plug, so didn't pick up on that right away.

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Modern_medicine_isnt 12 points a year ago

I was taught to call the neutral "common" cause neutral makes it sound safe.

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Canonical_Warlock 8 points a year ago

Typically in a US house it should be safe. Just assuming it is actually safe on the other hand is profoundly unsafe.

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TwiddleTwaddle 2 points a year ago

Incorrect. The neutral wire is a current carrying conductor and will generally be just as "hot" as the hot wire.

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bradorsomething 3 points a year ago

Okay fine, I’ll jump in. The neutral will carry the same amperage as a hot in a circuit. When you add yourself to the circuit accidentally, your resistance and the resistance of the intended load will divide up the voltage relative to your resistances. But the same amperage will flow through each of you assuming no other electrical pathway exists.

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Ilovethebomb 3 points a year ago

Image being confidently incorrect in the comments of a confidently incorrect post.

Under normal circuit conditions, the only voltage present on Neutral would be whatever voltage loss is occurring between the load and the tie in point between neutral and earth.

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TwiddleTwaddle 8 points a year ago

Different circumstances are different. Neturals are current carrying conductors. Neutrals are also grounded (as in bonded to ground at the main panel). In the case of someone wiring a recepticle or making joints in a junction box without turning off the circuit, one side of the neutral will almost certainly become disconnected from its return path in that process. When doing electrical work you absolutely do not consider the N wire safe for this reason.

Sure, if you touch the N lug in a hot panel or the N side of a receptacle while everything's properly wired you won't get shocked, but nobody has any reason to touch the N conductor if you aren't working working on the circuit/box/panel. I'll admit my use of "generally" above isnt exactly appropriate when you consider that a home doesnt "generally" have someone working on the wiring. Similarly my "incorrect" at the comment above me is less than 100% accurate, but I maintain that in the case of actual electrical work being done (the only time this conversation matters) you can never consider N to be safe.

All circuits are hot. All guns are loaded. All knives are sharp.

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hildegarde 11 points a year ago

everything about this is wrong. the most fundamental part is the fact that you don't wire north american plugs. Wiring your own plugs is a british thing, hence why the case is shaped like the british plug.

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Steve 13 points a year ago

Home Depot has a whole big shelf of north american plugs that anyone can wire up however they want.

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i_am_not_a_robot 12 points a year ago

In fact it was compulsory in Britain until the 1980s/90s. I'm not sure exactly when it changed, but the reason was due to different electricity companies having different sockets (and therefore plugs). It was standardised way before then, but I guess if that's the way it has always been done nobody thinks of changing it.

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jabjoe 10 points a year ago

My oldest (15) was just taught how to wire a plug at her high school. We're in the UK. I don't think I was (90s), but my dad will had shown me and I don't remember not knowing.

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__nobodynowhere 2 points a year ago

In the US, split-phase 240v appliances, like dryers and electric ranges, often do not come with a plug pre-wired. This is because older homes lack a ground on the outlet side. 240v works in the US by having two (120v) hots which are 180 degrees out of phase. Outlets in older homes have 3 sockets. Two lives (black and red) and a neutral (white). Outlets in newer homes have 4 sockets. The same 3 from above as well as a ground (green or bare). Normally you buy a pre-fabricated plug and do the wiring on the appliance side but you still need to match the right prong to the right terminal.

Of course, replacement plugs are also a thing if the original becomes damaged.

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higgsboson 1 point a year ago

you don't wire north american plugs

I don't? Please, do go on. I am interested to know how all my appliances apparently work by magic.

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EpeeGnome 6 points a year ago

Well, yes, someone wires the plugs at the appliance cord factory, but unless you work in appliance cord manufacturing it's typically not the appliance user. And yes, there are exceptions, such as installing some heavy appliances or replacing damaged plugs, but that shouldn't be typical for "all" of someone's appliances.

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Modern_medicine_isnt 4 points a year ago

I'm interested to know how you are wiring plugs... and why. They are sold pre wired in my area. Are they not in yours?

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hildegarde 2 points a year ago

North american plugs are not serviceable like british ones. The contacts are molded in plastic at the factory.

Opening a plug to service the wires is not possible. They don't open, nor do the plugs have fuses.

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burntbacon 3 points a year ago

Serviceable, sure, but they literally make replacement plugs that you would do yourself, in which case, knowing how to wire them is a whole, you know, thing.

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jerkface 10 points a year ago

I feel like federating this image is not in humanity's best interest

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Spacehooks 8 points a year ago

It also looks like plug neutral is connected to plug live too? So its one single node to ground on the plug side?

are we sure the prompt was not "how to create a plug in north America for maximum damage?" 😄

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Ilovethebomb 8 points a year ago

Nah, maximum damage would be phase to earth alone, at least in terms of human safety.

This is a great way to wreck a socket though.

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J92 7 points a year ago

How to create a plug in North America to find an unlabelled breaker.

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Canonical_Warlock -3 points a year ago

Except it wouldn't do any damage because there isn't anything running to the plug except for a single ground wire.

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4am 3 points a year ago

It’s a plug, not an outlet

Current source is from the prongs.

It’s just so bad it trips you up. Also, in North America it’s fairly rare to wire a plug; much more common to wire up an outlet. In EU, didn’t many appliances ship without a wire and you were expected to install your own? Is that still a thing?

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__nobodynowhere 1 point a year ago

Yeah sure... Until you plug it into the wall

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Ilovethebomb 1 point a year ago

Where does that ground wire go, do you know?

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floquant 8 points a year ago

There's no live wire in this diagram. There is a section of black wire that is labeled "live", but it's just connecting the ground wire to the top prong with no voltage applied. The unlabeled white wire shorts them together. If the white wire was cut, then the top prong would be ground.

This is just a fancy way to short neutral and ground.

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Damage 9 points a year ago

Until you plug it in. Then it's a weird way to test your GFCI.

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__nobodynowhere 1 point a year ago

How? The cord coming from the plug would be wired to an appliance. How is having an unplugged appliance going to test anything?

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Damage 2 points a year ago

Well, since this is all bollocks, who's to say what's on the other side of the cord...

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4am 5 points a year ago

It’s a plug, not an outlet. I made the same mistake because it’s such an astonishingly bad diagram.

Hot phase comes in from the prong, travels to the screw via black wire, then directly into ground.

Of course, it’s a moot point because you cannot plug this into a North American outlet, the prongs are in the wrong position.

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Ilovethebomb 3 points a year ago

There is no ground plug in this diagram, only phase and neutral. With the ground connected to phase.

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4am 1 point a year ago

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RememberTheApollo_ 6 points a year ago

Forgot to add “safely” to the prompt.

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Ephera 6 points a year ago

For anyone else confused, the comments that OP is talking about are those from the cross-post: https://lemmy.nz/post/28693796

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theneverfox 6 points a year ago

No you won't... The "live" wire is just shorting neutral to ground. You'd need a second, far worse, problem for this to do anything

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Ilovethebomb 4 points a year ago

but if the neutral was broken

Isn't that what I said though?

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theneverfox 1 point a year ago

No? You said it would trip the circuit breaker

I mean in spirit, we agree this is a nonsense wiring diagram for sure, but my interpretation is that we disagree on the details

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Ilovethebomb 1 point a year ago

I mean, you said you'd need a second fault on the system to get shocked, and I described that fault in the description, and said this would need to happen in order to electrocute someone.

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theneverfox 2 points a year ago

Rereading your post a third time, that is not my take away

But the very well might have been your intention. Language is delicate like that sometimes...I don't know what you meant, but if you tell me that's what you meant by those words, I believe you

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__nobodynowhere 3 points a year ago

You may be doing what I initially did and mentally treating it as an outlet. The live prong on the displayed plug would be inserted into an real live outlet thus energizing both the neutral and ground. The dead short should quickly trip the breaker but maybe not before the outlet or plug is nice and crispified.

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theneverfox 2 points a year ago

Huh... Yeah, fair enough

In my defense the text says outlet

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30p87 5 points a year ago

I've wired plugs with like 12 and a large part of our house with 14 or so. Ofc, with my dad and depending on the circumstances a qualified electrician checking, but no matter how wild it got, I never made a mistake

How are there people needing help to simply wire a plug? The hardest part is to open that damn thing!

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SketchySeaBeast 28 points a year ago

Ofc, with my dad and depending on the circumstances a qualified electrician checking, but no matter how wild it got, I never made a mistake

This is you saying you got help wiring a plug.

What if people don't have their dad or a qualified electrician to check? They need help from somewhere. AI is a stupid place to look for it, but people need help doing things they never have before. Would you prefer they guess?

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30p87 2 points a year ago

I never had a simple plug or socket checked after my first five or so. For larger networks, I just shared the plan I made in my head. And the qualified electrician was there once, for the HV lines, as legally required.

Also, not guess, but know. It's very easy, especially plugs and sockets. Switches I can see someone pulling up the manufacturers docs to check which contacts are interconnected.

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SketchySeaBeast 14 points a year ago

Yes, after your first five, but before that you needed help. If this is someone's first what are they do to? How are they supposed to know without getting some sort of help?

"It's easy, just do like my dad showed me!* isn't helpful if they don't know your dad.

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30p87 -2 points a year ago

My dad did not help me. Plugging in three strands where they obviously belong is not something someone needs help with. Again, he checked the end result. As in, one glance at the result the first time and plugging the plug into the socket in the first few times, because at age 12 an electric shock is much more problematic than at age 36.

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Ilovethebomb 9 points a year ago

Someone replied to me saying this picture of a plug is a dead circuit, because nothing is connected to anything, they genuinely don't seem to understand what a plug is.

They walk among us.

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Speculater 1 point a year ago

To be fair, this circuit is absolutely safe at long as the breakers are installed.

Edit: Because this will trip the circuit breaker. It's a short y'all.

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Ilovethebomb 8 points a year ago

And the neutral is unbroken.

You're putting a lot of faith in the rest of the installation.

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Speculater 3 points a year ago

I was being tongue in cheek. This will pop the circuit breaker, but to your point, may cause a fire with the insulation of the neutral. So I admit, it's not "perfectly safe." Lol.

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Tiger_Man_ 3 points a year ago

Do you have dc in your plugs in usa or did the ai mess it up so much

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DacoTaco 5 points a year ago

Even with dc this is fucked, + and - are shorted. Its fucked regardless

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LifeInMultipleChoice 3 points a year ago

No, those plugs are 110-120v ac

Edit: assuming this is supposed to be a standard plug, which should have the prongs side by side not on top of each other.

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Aeri 2 points a year ago

If you're asking a large language model for directions to wire electrical circuits I think you might have a bona fide mental disability and I'm not being funny or silly in any way.

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SW42 -17 points a year ago

If it would be done exactly like in the picture nothing would happen, as the only wire going in is the ground wire.

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Ephera 13 points a year ago

In case you had the same brainfart as me, it's a plug, not an outlet, so there could be no wires coming out of it and you could still short-circuit the outlet you plug it into...

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Ilovethebomb 12 points a year ago

I know we're famous for not reading the article, but you didn't even read the post.

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SW42 -7 points a year ago

I just looked at the picture and the only line that goes to the plug is the grounding wire.

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Ilovethebomb 8 points a year ago

Your comment is nearly identical to one made by someone in the linked post, and I'm pretty sure you're trolling at this point.

I won't be engaging any further with you.

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viking -7 points a year ago

You're correct, and people are morons.

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Successful_Try543 8 points a year ago

It's a plug, not a socket. By inserting the two shorted pins (white wire) into any socket, you would essentially short the live and neutral connectors of the socket.

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SW42 3 points a year ago

Oooh, yeah. Makes sense. Sorry, I had a brain fart. Of course it would short the outlet. Would definitely trip a breaker. Was thinking of an outlet for some reason.

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viking -3 points a year ago

Correct, so you'd trip a breaker. You wouldn't however electrocute yourself.

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Successful_Try543 8 points a year ago

If this was actually done, the most likely outcome is it would trip a circuit breaker, but if the neutral was broken, it would connect phase directly to the casing, and likely electrocute someone.

If the neutral wire is faulty, the live wire is still connected to the ground wire and subsequently to the casing of the device. Thus, if somebody would touch the casing, the current (maximum what the breaker permits without opening) would flow through that person.

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confidently_incorrect

confidently_incorrect

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When people are way too smug about their wrong answer.

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This community follows the rules of the lemmy.world instance and the lemmy.org code of conduct. I’ve summarised them here:

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No insulting or harassing other members. That includes name calling.
Respect differences of opinion. Civil discussion/debate is fine, arguing is not. Criticise ideas, not people.
Keep unrequested/unstructured critique to a minimum.
Remember we have all chosen to be here voluntarily. Respect the spent time and effort people have spent creating posts in order to share something they find amusing with you.
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confidently_incorrect

confidently_incorrect

@lemmy.world

login for more options

When people are way too smug about their wrong answer.

Posting guidelines.

All posts in this community have come from elsewhere, it is not original content, the poster in this community is not OP. The person who posts in this community isn’t necessarily endorsing whatever the post is talking about and they are not looking to argue with you about the content in the post.

You are welcome to discuss and debate any topic but arguments are not welcome here. I consider debate/discussions to be civil; people with different opinions participating in respectful conversations. It becomes an argument as soon as someone becomes aggressive, nasty, insulting or just plain unpleasant. Report argumentative comments, then ignore them.

There is currently no rule about how recent a post needs to be because the community is about the comeback part, not the topic.

Rules:

• Be civil and remember the human.

• No trolling, insults or name calling. Swearing in general is fine, but not to insult someone.

• No bigotry of any kind, including homophobia, transphobia, sexism and racism.

• You are welcome to discuss and debate any topic but arguments are not welcome here. I consider debate/discussions to be civil; people with different opinions participating in respectful conversations. It becomes an argument as soon as someone becomes aggressive, nasty, insulting or just plain unpleasant. Report argumentative comments, then ignore them.

• Try not to get too political. A lot of these posts will involve politics, but this isn’t the place for political arguments.

• Participate in good faith - don’t be aggressive and don’t argue for arguements sake.

• Mark NSFW posts if they contain nudity.

• Satire is allowed but please start the post title with [satire] so other users can filter it out if they’d like.

Please report comments that break site or community rules to the mods. If you break the rules you’ll receive one warning before being banned from this community.

This community follows the rules of the lemmy.world instance and the lemmy.org code of conduct. I’ve summarised them here:

Be civil, remember the human.
No insulting or harassing other members. That includes name calling.
Respect differences of opinion. Civil discussion/debate is fine, arguing is not. Criticise ideas, not people.
Keep unrequested/unstructured critique to a minimum.
Remember we have all chosen to be here voluntarily. Respect the spent time and effort people have spent creating posts in order to share something they find amusing with you.
Swearing in general is fine, swearing to insult another commenter isn’t.
No racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, xenophobia or any other type of bigotry.
No incitement of violence or promotion of violent ideologies.

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