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What feature/utility/app are you surprised is not installed by default in Linux distributions?

3 years ago by mFat to c/linux

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gammarays 87 points 3 years ago

I think most people (including myself) prefer a minimal desktop by default, and then proceed to install only the software they need. Nevertheless, it always surprises me when I log in to a system that doesn't have vim.

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SSUPII 59 points 3 years ago

For almost all users, especially beginners, nano is just simpler faster and better. A lot of distributions are bundling it, and I am finding indeed systems without vim at all.

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kylian0087 40 points 3 years ago

Although most of the times while vim is not installed vi is. Even often together with nano.

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Ozzy 21 points 3 years ago

Man I tried to use vi once because I started with vim and wanted to see what all it was before, and holy shit vim really is IMPROVED

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d_k_bo 20 points 3 years ago

Especially for beginners, micro would be even better.

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Neil 11 points 3 years ago

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burgersc12 2 points 3 years ago

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s20 17 points 3 years ago

I disagree. Don't get me wrong, vim is amazing and all that, but I think nano is easier for new users to grok out of the box, making it a better choice most of the time. What it lacks in features it makes up for in transparency.

100% agree about the minimal set of desktop apps, though. That drives me crazy.

Just my 0.02$.

Edit: silly mistakes and clarification

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Drito 8 points 3 years ago

In all distro I tried, I always found Vi.

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digger 10 points 3 years ago

Vi is standardized in both POSIX and Single Unix Specification.

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lukas 1 point 3 years ago

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the_lone_wolf 3 points 3 years ago

but they do contains vi

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user224 50 points 3 years ago

less, I don't remember what distro it was, but there wasn't less. There was more though.

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atlasraven31 33 points 3 years ago

Sometimes, more is less.

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unsaid0415 10 points 3 years ago

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the_lone_wolf 2 points 3 years ago

There is a variable in less source code which keep status if less should behave like more

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bert 6 points 3 years ago

But when will "then" be "now"?

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agressivelyPassive 4 points 3 years ago

Tuesday.

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Decker108 1 point 3 years ago

Will the future be better tomorrow?

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unionagainstdhmo 3 points 3 years ago

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duncesplayed 2 points 3 years ago

It was, but it was (and still is) a Unix tool. I believe POSIX still requires that more be provided (even if it's just less secretly).

The original Unix more could only go forwards. Someone wanted to make something like more that could go both forwards and backwards, so he called it less as a joke (because "less" is a "backwards more"). For the past 40 years, everyone's realized that less is much better than the original more, so nobody uses the original any more.

(MSDOS took the idea of "more" before "less" caught on).

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JackbyDev 2 points 3 years ago

Also, sometimes they have an old version of less. There was a change in the past, I don't know, five or so years that made the "exit if less than one page" flag behave better. I don't remember the specifics but it made using it as a fit pager way better. It used to be that it was difficult to have it act like cat when the output was less than a page. But newer versions support it.

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Sir_Simon_Spamalot 1 point 3 years ago

What distro was this?

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Dotdev 45 points 3 years ago

git not installed in ubuntu based distro was the shock for me.

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SaltyIceteaMaker 40 points 3 years ago

Git. I feel like that is a pretty important part of any linux os nowadays

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ChristianWS 39 points 3 years ago

KDE Connect on KDE distros, just feels part of the KDE experience

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Deconceptualist 38 points 3 years ago

htop

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Nick -2 points 3 years ago

What's the point to install htop when top is being preinstalled like 99% of time?

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Toribor 4 points 3 years ago

Much easier and faster to get useful information out of htop.

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Nick 0 points 3 years ago

With all my respect, there is nothing difficult to get information from top.

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backhdlp 31 points 3 years ago

git isn't in Arch's base-devel

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gamey -1 points 3 years ago

Damn, I am quite sure it's in Debians build-essentials!

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atlasraven31 29 points 3 years ago

A Doom-clone. I mean, come on.

Seriously tho, Gparted for how useful it is.

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solberg 24 points 3 years ago

Nano (or pico). I had to use vi one time 😭

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agressivelyPassive 13 points 3 years ago

Which distro doesn't ship nano? I've only ever seen this in embedded or docker contexts.

Condolences for your vile experiences, though.

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Sethayy 2 points 3 years ago

I think Debian doesn't cause I used it in some containers

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nik282000 3 points 3 years ago

The Debian LXC containers ship without nano, the normal (net/dvd/cd) install have nano.

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Dotdev 1 point 3 years ago

Debian does ship nano not vim.

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solberg 1 point 3 years ago

I think it was OpenWRT

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Toribor 1 point 3 years ago

Yeah I find that nano is on basically everything but alpine or other minimalist distros for containers. As long as I have access to it on the host I'm doing okay.

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Ozzy 9 points 3 years ago

🤕 <-- he was forced to use vi

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LeFantome 3 points 3 years ago

How did you get out of it?

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JackbyDev 2 points 3 years ago

I remember using nano in college when I was a baby dev. I would write everything locally then paste into nano. I don't remember if the professor gave us an FTP link or if I was just trying around but I pasted the server address into the file explorer (I think nautilus, I don't remember) and it managed to connect. It made it all so easy.

Good times, writing assembly in nano lmao!

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vsis 24 points 3 years ago

tmux, htop, vim

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JWBananas 2 points 3 years ago

What distros don't include tmux and vim? Ubuntu has had them for at least a decade.

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vsis 1 point 3 years ago

by default?

My work laptop came with Ubuntu preinstaled and didn't have tmux nor htop.

Vim is not present by default in at least debian and arch. Although vi is present in every distribution I believe.

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JWBananas 2 points 3 years ago

I can see that being the case for the Desktop variant. For the Server variant you get vim and tmux out of the box.

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cows_are_underrated 1 point 3 years ago

I was surprised that gnome ships with comes with it in default.

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Swiggles 23 points 3 years ago

I am surprised that vi is often available, but not vim. It's really annoying on many RHEL based distros, because I am so used to typing vim. Otherwise there is just git I deem essential.

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gamey 3 points 3 years ago

Definitely not limited to RHEL!

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quat 1 point 3 years ago

Nowadays vi is just a symlink to vim.tiny, so you're actually running vim (in vi mode).

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Swiggles 1 point 3 years ago

No. If you have vim installed that's true on many (some?) systems. As I said some distros have vi available, but not vim which is the annoying part.

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quat 3 points 3 years ago

The original vi has not been maintained for many years. Most distributions, including Debian, Fedora, etc, use a version of Vim which (mostly) is similar to how Vi was.

From Fedoras wiki:
"On Fedora, Vim (specifically the vim-minimal package) is also used to provide /bin/vi. This vi command provides no syntax highlighting for opened files, by default, just like the original vi editor. The vim-minimal package comes pre-installed on Fedora."

From the vim-tiny package description on Debian:
"This package contains a minimal version of Vim compiled with no GUI and a small subset of features. This package's sole purpose is to provide the vi binary for base installations."

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JackbyDev 2 points 3 years ago

R.I.P. Bram Moolenaar. You made me think of it when you said go is unmaintained. I went to vim.org to see who is taking over vim but the security certificate is expired.

It reminded me of this grim realization I had in my grandparents house. They were getting old, I think one or maybe both were in a nursing home by then. The house was falling apart as they were. I was going up the deck stairs and a stair broke under my foot, luckily one of the very low ones. Some dishes had some mold on them in the cabinet. And now going to vim.org, the cert is broken.

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Swiggles 1 point 3 years ago

You are actually correct. I just checked the manifest of RHEL and it provides vim-minimal and not vi like I assumed.

I noticed that it behaves a bit different than the version available on AIX for example which for sure uses real vi, but I never gave it a second thought. Interesting.

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JackbyDev 1 point 3 years ago

Yeah, at least some distros have VIM tiny or whatever it's called so my muscle memory benefits me.

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captain_aggravated 1 point 3 years ago

Most distros I mess with have busybox installed, which as vi in it, but yeah sudo apt install vim is one of the first commands I run.

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Ecology8622 -6 points 3 years ago

Solution - learn using vi. You already did most of the work by learmjng vim.

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Swiggles 10 points 3 years ago

There is not really anything to learn. It is just lacking some useful features and shortcuts which make it slower to use. It's still much better than nothing.

Usually my biggest issue is that I am so used to write vim over vi. At least for small edits.

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pixelprimer 23 points 3 years ago

netstat curl and git

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d_k_bo 20 points 3 years ago

netstat is mostly deprecated and superseded by the ss command.

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ninsix 4 points 3 years ago

I had an error with Xampp starting the Apache server by not having netstat installed

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Zucca 2 points 3 years ago

Wait? ss? why haven't I heard of this?

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d_k_bo 2 points 3 years ago

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Zucca 1 point 3 years ago

Oh, I'm familiar with ip command. I've just completely missed ss.

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Snowplow8861 23 points 3 years ago

Traceroute.

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JackbyDev 4 points 3 years ago

Tracer T

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perishthethought 1 point 3 years ago

Does anyone know why this isn't included?

It's always so useful for network stuff.

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Supermariofan67 20 points 3 years ago

git rsync htop `

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inetknght 4 points 3 years ago

Add tmux and you've got almost everything I install on a fresh install of any distro.

Almost everything. The last thing is vim.

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Ecology8622 20 points 3 years ago

IMO nothing. As long as it can detect network I can install whatever tools I need.

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DickFiasco 5 points 3 years ago

Agreed. The alternative is bloating the system with tools the user may not need. I'd rather just have to install a bunch of stuff on first use.

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iopq 1 point 3 years ago

I couldn't install some Python socks package because I need a proxy to access the Internet, but I needed the package to install any updates through socks, so I couldn't install the package because I didn't have it

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tho 1 point 3 years ago

wifi drivers then?

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shotgun_crab 18 points 3 years ago

Definitely git

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spez 2 points 3 years ago

Which one doesn't have it?

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MigratingtoLemmy 2 points 3 years ago

Debian doesn't have it installed by default. Can confirm, I'd love to have git so I can pull down my scripts and go back to sleep with every new machine.

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xcjs 3 points 3 years ago

Sounds like a job for Ansible. ;-)

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MigratingtoLemmy 1 point 3 years ago

I suppose you're right.

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leirda -1 points 3 years ago

at least Arch (and derivatives) and Guix. probably a lot more of them

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gamma 2 points 3 years ago

Comparing Arch's base + base-devel is kinda unfiar, there's only 54 packages total there.

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tho 2 points 3 years ago

it's easier to list which distros have it ootb (none)

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leirda 2 points 3 years ago

real easy indeed x)

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JackbyDev 16 points 3 years ago

vim

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SamsonSeinfelder 16 points 3 years ago

useradd - I just wanted to give a friend my notebook for a python lecture and thought I could just add him as a new user. Apparently not by default.

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superkret 9 points 3 years ago

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JackbyDev 2 points 3 years ago

It's the standard editor!

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x3i 7 points 3 years ago

Ran into this some time ago and learned that there is a more rudimentary command adduser instead but it does not do things like home folder creation

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9488fcea02a9 5 points 3 years ago

Yeah, useradd should be the default over adduser

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BCsven 4 points 3 years ago

Seems like it would have to exist to create your initial login, unless you only had a root user

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maxbossing 2 points 3 years ago

You can just manually edit /etc/passwd

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BCsven 1 point 3 years ago

I haven't used that since the 90s on HP Unix. Do you get to set default permissions for file creation there, and also add user groups?

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ClemaX 13 points 3 years ago

ncdu for analyzing disk space usage in TUI.

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fxt_ryknow 13 points 3 years ago

First installs for me are always vim and tmux.

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Jargus 13 points 3 years ago

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hottari 11 points 3 years ago
  • Multimedia/ h264 codecs ??
  • KDE/GSconnect
  • Something like Arch's downgrade package + an archive of package versions
  • Hardware video acceleration support is sorely lacking
  • Picture-in-picture in Gnome's Wayland (bug that a gnome-shell extension fixes!)

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bjorney 16 points 3 years ago

Multimedia codecs have a different license agreement than the OS so they aren't bundled by default for a reason

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hottari -9 points 3 years ago

I don't care about the licenses. If I click on my media and it refuses to play because some codec is omitted by default, am annoyed nonetheless.

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bjorney 16 points 3 years ago

Most distros have a checkbox during the installer that will add non-free components. It's a separate EULA you need to agree to so they can't do it for you.

You may not care, but the distro provider's legal team absolutely cares about not getting sued for automatically bundling components with an incompatible license agreement

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hottari -8 points 3 years ago

The non-free components I've seen on installers are usually for Nvidia's proprietary drivers. Not codecs.

Sounds like legal panic if you ask me. There's been no precedent for litigation on use of licensed codecs which most have been using either way prior in their builds and packages.

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hottari 3 points 3 years ago

More annoyed when the distro doesn't even bother to document how to properly install the "missing" codecs.

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JackbyDev 1 point 3 years ago

Don't mistake this as condescension, but doesn't VLC solve all of that?

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Jargus 4 points 3 years ago

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QwertySpace 4 points 3 years ago

Not sure why KDE/GSconnect would need to be preinstalled tbh. But I agree with the others

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hottari 5 points 3 years ago

Quality of life improvement. Plus it's normal for operating systems to have some kind of smartphone/smart device integration now.

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QwertySpace 1 point 3 years ago

Plus it's normal for operating systems to have some kind of smartphone/smart device integration now.

And I don't approve of this transition. It's unnecessary bloat. Just install it if you want it.

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hottari 0 points 3 years ago

Only a Gentoo user can make that claim. Hope you are one.

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Jumuta 5 points 3 years ago

because kde connect is so well made and everyone with a smartphone should use it

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QwertySpace 1 point 3 years ago

I don't really want my smartphone notifs on my PC. It should be an optional addition, like it currently is.

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Jumuta 1 point 3 years ago

I actually turned off the notification sync, I only use it for file transfers and the remote control features

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user224 3 points 3 years ago

Oh yeah! That downgrade option sounds cool. The only time I kinda regretted being on Manjaro. VirtualBox 7 still doesn't have functional graphics. I tried downgrade, but that didn't work. Maybe I should have tried deleting the VirtualBox config 🤔

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qyron 10 points 3 years ago

Let's try the other way around: what default apps are pre installed that really don't need or should not be?

I get that most distros try to give a good out of the box desktop for the average user, while also saving time for who is (trying to) providing services or building machines to sell but it can get annoying booting into a fresh install, take a look at the defaults and go "nah, that's going away, and that, that and the other".

I'm not advocating for LFS but sometimes I wish we could get an option to install just what is necessary to make the hardware run and a chosen desktop or window manager and from there install whatever we may need.

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OldPain 18 points 3 years ago

Sounds like Arch.

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qyron 8 points 3 years ago

Not a chance. Me and Arch don't mix. I'm a Debianite.

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JackbyDev 3 points 3 years ago

Debian, btw

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vrighter 5 points 3 years ago

seconded. That is exactly how I built my system, starting from a minimal install

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cows_are_underrated 2 points 3 years ago

KDE shipped with so much useless stuff.

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RickyRigatoni 1 point 3 years ago

coreutils.

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rattking 9 points 3 years ago

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gamma 4 points 3 years ago

type -p is a shell builtin though, and one character shorter :)

Although you may prefer tool=$(command -v tool)

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gamey 9 points 3 years ago

htop, distrobox and in some cases Flatpak!

Edit: after reading the comments I want to add curl and git, seriously, why aren't those a default?!

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UntouchedWagons 9 points 3 years ago

nslookup quite a few times I'd try and resolve a domain name only to find out the command isn't available and I'd need to google what package adds it.

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demonsword 4 points 3 years ago

no nslookup, go with dig

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astroturds 8 points 3 years ago

I'm always shocked that other distros haven't made their own version of Yast from opensuse

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Ozzy 4 points 3 years ago

I've tried yast and I'm still unsure what it was supposed to do. I just poked around, asked me if I know than I'm doing and then just left

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astroturds 2 points 3 years ago

It's just a general system setup and config tool. I'm assuming that, like me, you already know how to do all that stuff without yast but it's good for newbies and people that aren't super nerds. With all of the anti terminal stuff I always read about on the internet you'd think at least ubuntu would have their own version of it or something similar.

"YaST is a SUSE Linux Enterprise Server tool that provides a graphical interface for all essential installation and system configuration tasks. Whether you need to update packages, configure a printer, modify firewall settings, set up an FTP server, or partition a hard disk—you can do it using YaST."

But yeah, I actually hardly ever use it myself.

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Ozzy 1 point 3 years ago

Ohhhhhhh, that makes sense, thanks for explaining!

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Sir_Simon_Spamalot 2 points 3 years ago

I think MX Linux has something similar

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Turtle 8 points 3 years ago

The first couple commands I run after install:

$ sudo apt install vim
$ sudo apt autopurge libreoffice*

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cows_are_underrated 11 points 3 years ago

I actually like Libre office very much, since it's a good open source office software.

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Turtle 3 points 3 years ago

I'm not suggesting it's bad, I just don't use it much and it's always preinstalled.

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stepanzak 1 point 3 years ago

Which office suite do you use?

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schnurrito 12 points 3 years ago

Some people don't need an office suite at all.

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Turtle 3 points 3 years ago

When I need an office suite, Libreoffice is the one I use, but it's so infrequent that I reinstall writer or whatever part I need at the time and then uninstall again.

The main reason it bothers me is I will see it being updated frequently (and they're not small updates) - and I've probably never ran the thing since the last OS install most of the time.

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spez 8 points 3 years ago

Mission Center, it finally brings a task manager like UI on Linux. Alternative for people not wanting to use a TUI like htop.

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FooBarrington 8 points 3 years ago

I always use:

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spez 3 points 3 years ago

Thank you so much for listing tealdeer. It's way faster than tldr.

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FooBarrington 4 points 3 years ago

You're welcome! If you're a different spez. If you are the Reddit spez, you are not welcome.

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nik282000 8 points 3 years ago

Debian, sudo, at least when ever I install it without a desktop.

edit: I'm dumb af, it tells you right in the installer, I just never read it

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Eris 6 points 3 years ago

I read that apparently if you don't input a password for root that it apparently installs sudo. I might be wrong about this but could be worth a Google

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quat 2 points 3 years ago

The installer says this when it asks you to type a root password. I don't know why, but for some reason the information is both right there and easy to miss.

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Holzkohlen 2 points 3 years ago

Please tell me that this is some brand new feature they added yesterday or smth

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quat 1 point 3 years ago

The option to not set a root password and instead let the regular user use sudo seems to be mentioned in the installer for the first time around 2007, so it's been there for a while.

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nik282000 1 point 3 years ago

That kinda makes sense but I never would have found it on my own.

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quat 5 points 3 years ago

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Holzkohlen 2 points 3 years ago

Why would anyone continue reading after "you need a password for root"? You just the rest of the paragraph is gonna be ramblings about what constitutes a good password and so on. And it is exactly that and then at the very end they tell you about sudo. No wonder I always missed it.

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nik282000 0 points 3 years ago

Ill have to check and see if thats in the TUI installer too. TY

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JohnBon 2 points 3 years ago

Classic mistake :)

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5714 8 points 3 years ago

dhcpcd (Arch)

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caseyweederman 8 points 3 years ago

Well really

anything (Arch)

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joel_feila 7 points 3 years ago

No time shift or equivalent in neon.

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dmrzl 6 points 3 years ago

bash-completion

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mfat 1 point 3 years ago

This and command-not-found

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RegalPotoo 6 points 3 years ago

htop. I get that top is ancient and just about part of the definition of a standard Linux system, but damn is it unfriendly

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JWBananas 6 points 3 years ago

Lately, jq

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gamma 2 points 3 years ago

awk for the modern age

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rbos 5 points 3 years ago

mosh, tmux, htop, vim

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learnbyexample 5 points 3 years ago

EPUB reader

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lloram239 8 points 3 years ago

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the_lone_wolf 4 points 3 years ago

Ya, epub is just html + zip

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eruchitanda 3 points 3 years ago

udisks2.

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igorlogius 3 points 3 years ago

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QwertySpace 7 points 3 years ago

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igorlogius 2 points 3 years ago

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Elephantpurple7603 2 points 3 years ago

Stacer

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RegularIndependent98 2 points 3 years ago

File manager necessary actions and plugins

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netburnr 2 points 3 years ago

Telnet client

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Sir_Simon_Spamalot 2 points 3 years ago

The 90s called...

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toff 2 points 3 years ago

bash and zsh shell history suggest box aka hstr. A bash history which is sorted by the times you use a command and not in a chronological order. Sooooooo good 😉

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Foreverwinter 2 points 3 years ago

neofetch

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coltorl 0 points 3 years ago

One of my two only used commands. The other being yay.

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Gush 0 points 3 years ago

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murtaza64 3 points 3 years ago

What does that mean? When I've used yay, it only asks for sudo privileges when installing the package (and so does pacman)

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Astaroth 1 point 3 years ago

I always use yay so I can easily find and use the history, the only time I use pacman without yay is to check the man page

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cmeerw 1 point 3 years ago

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punkwalrus 1 point 3 years ago

I have a lot of SBCs, and have various ansible scripts that install stuff in "levels" depending on what I need.

Basic level is the "must-haves."

python 3-minimal, chrony, openssh-server, python 3-apt, aptitude, unattended-upgrades, boxes, figlet, dialog, apt-utils, git, htop, multitail, ncdu, sysstat, vim, tree, util-linux

There's, also "server level," "desktop level," and "demo level," for when I do training.

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simonced 6 points 3 years ago

recently, I use btop in replacement of htop, really easy to use and pretty to look at.

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PuppyOSAndCoffee 0 points 3 years ago

abcde.sh

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perishthethought 3 points 3 years ago

The CD ripper, yeah? Agreed, great tool.

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Terevos 0 points 3 years ago

emacs

I realize half of you people never touch it, but come on. It's not that large a package these days.

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the_lone_wolf 4 points 3 years ago

It pull 400MB of packages + deps on my machine

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Terevos 3 points 3 years ago

You probably installed the graphical one. emacs-nox is command-line only and significantly smaller.

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From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Linux is a family of open source Unix-like operating systems based on the Linux kernel, an operating system kernel first released on September 17, 1991 by Linus Torvalds. Linux is typically packaged in a Linux distribution (or distro for short).

Distributions include the Linux kernel and supporting system software and libraries, many of which are provided by the GNU Project. Many Linux distributions use the word "Linux" in their name, but the Free Software Foundation uses the name GNU/Linux to emphasize the importance of GNU software, causing some controversy.

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