Is it not grotesque to give a random person 1.2 billion dollars in a lottery?

3 years ago by Camzing to c/asklemmy

It serms incredible to me to give over a billion dollars to a random person.

Lauchs 155 points 3 years ago

Not really.

The lottery is paid for by those who all have an equal chance of winning that prize. Also, the profits from lotteries are usually spent on social funds etc.

I feel more conflicted about thr fact that it preys on addiction and those who buy the most lottery tickets are often those who can least afford them. I find that much more grotesque than a random person getting very lucky, but to each their own.

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Camzing 8 points 3 years ago

Half would go to the government no?

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drdabbles 46 points 3 years ago

In the US, close to half of the winnings do go to the lottery, plus a portion of each lottery ticket usually goes to fund some government agency. Schools, programs for the impoverished and disenfranchised, etc.

The real question, in my opinion, is if you are willing to spend that much money on a ticket, why aren't you willing to spend that much money on just outright funding government programs? Imagine if 100% of what someone paid for a ticket went to programs for the disenfranchised? That could make real difference.

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NightAuthor 8 points 3 years ago

Probably worth noting that, at least in places like Texas, they take the funds from the lottery, allocate it to school, and then take the same amount of money out of schools to fund whatever bullshit they want.

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callouscomic 1 point 3 years ago

And then in some places they decide to divert the school money for a new Raiders stadium.

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rebul -31 points 3 years ago

I spend about $10 per year on lottery tickets. I pay upwards of $40k in taxes, much of which is funneled to "disenfranchised". I'm good, thanks.

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Usernameblankface 11 points 3 years ago

Ok, but if you had a guarantee that your $10 would go directly to the disenfranchised with no chances of returning millions to you, how would that change things?

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bradorsomething 6 points 3 years ago

You make $200k a year, not bad!

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Honytawk 4 points 3 years ago

What is better:

  • 10$, of which 2$ goes towards taxes, 2$ goes to the winner, and 6$ goes to the people who own the lottery
  • 10$ of which directly goes to taxes
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Dkarma -2 points 3 years ago

You pay 40k in taxes then you're going fine so stfu you have no right to complain about the less fortunate who need a social safety net.

The gall and sense of entitlement you assholes have is fucking astounding.

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atomWood 7 points 3 years ago

That depends on the government in question. For example, the Canadian government does not have a claim on any kind of lottery or game show winnings.

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Camzing -1 points 3 years ago

On the first year I believe.

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atomWood 7 points 3 years ago

To my understanding, and a quick Google search, winnings are never taxed.

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phillaholic 1 point 3 years ago

Lottery > Casinos for sure

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dylanmorgan 107 points 3 years ago

It’s grotesque for ANYONE to have a billion dollars. Arguably the lottery winner is the only one to achieve that wealth by even sort-of ethical means.

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Bondrewd 7 points 3 years ago

By that measure, playing the stock exchange is just an advanced version of lottery.

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neptune 14 points 3 years ago

It is

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Bondrewd -5 points 3 years ago

Yep. Kind of ethical if you ask me... :P

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uriel238 11 points 3 years ago

Not really. Dividends always include value stolen from the workforce and the end customer in low pay and shoddier quality as enforced via a policy of shareholder primacy.

Anyone who hold stocks in a private company is stealing from the public.

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Keepitpushin 9 points 3 years ago

My guess you never heard of stock manipulation.

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MyFairJulia 3 points 3 years ago

The Spiffing Brit enters the chat

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Bondrewd -4 points 3 years ago

Technically you are investing in stocks they allow you to. Perfectly ethical.

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wombatula 2 points 3 years ago

It is, except for the way that money is derived from the labour of the workers, and the fact that you're not likely to make lifestyle changing amounts of money without already having a significant amount of money to gamble in the first place.

Not to mention the system is arguably much more "rigged" thanks to the major players in the scene, when you buy a lottery ticket you aren't competing against giant corporations that spend millions on figuring out the best way to buy lottery tickets.

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Cocodapuf 1 point 3 years ago

Well it's like a lottery but with more variables and where better knowledge or analysis can mean some "players"are more likely to win than others. It's inherently less fair than a lottery, which should be totally random.

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cricket97 -5 points 3 years ago

there are people who have over a billion dollars worth of positive impact on the world.

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ook_the_librarian 2 points 3 years ago

That's not grotesque and that's not wealth. But still a nice thought to keep in mind.

I wish these people were as famous as the loud-ass billionaires we have.

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Olhonestjim 0 points 3 years ago

There certainly have been such people. But none were ever billionaires. Such people do something which creates great value. Billionaires are parasites who do nothing but siphon value away from society.

Albert Einstein, Nikolai Vavilov, Marie Curie, Martin Luther King Jr, Alan Turing, Abraham Lincoln, Michael Faraday, Nelson Mandela, Isaac Newton, Edward Jenner, Harriet Tubman, Louis Pasteur, etc.

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fubo 59 points 3 years ago

State lotteries are in effect a tax on the uneducated; largely used to fund education.

But part of the reason they exist is that, in their absence, people spontaneously come up with even worse forms of gambling, like the old numbers game that funds the expansion of organized crime.

Most lottery players, especially scratch-ticket players, would be better off sticking that money under their mattresses or in credit-union accounts. However, again, when there are no gambling games around, people spontaneously invent them; abolishing state lotteries would not cause that money to go under mattresses or into credit unions.

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Hegar 35 points 3 years ago

largely used to fund education

Alas, nope.

Many states have laws saying that for every lottery dollar that goes to education, a dollar comes out of the education budget. Usually lottery profits end up in a general fund, the whole education thing is a legislated smoke screen.

The main function of state run lotteries is to take money away from organized criminals and give it to elected criminals instead.

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Camzing 12 points 3 years ago

That's incredible if true

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Hegar 15 points 3 years ago

Most states, there's this association that it supports education, but there's this bizarre scheme where for every lottery dollar that goes into the education budget, $1 from the education budget comes back out into the general fund.

So you end up just robbing Peter to pay Paul kind of thing. It doesn't actually add additional money to these causes that lotteries market themselves as helping.

https://www.wbur.org/...

a majority of the 42 states that run lotteries claim the games increase funding for education. But a CBS News investigation has found that most of the lottery sales never make it to a classroom.

https://www.cbsnews.com/...

But when you take away the amount shelled out for prizes (60% on ticket sales) and the cut to the lottery dealers, along with fees and operating expenses, it leaves about one third of the handle ($3.37 billion) for “aid to education”.

Moreover, NYS Assemblyman David DiPietro (R-147th District) claims the money is not always used for education expenses, at least not in the traditional sense.

According to DiPietro, the money on occasion has been “pinched off” by the state, to pay for a variety of items, including attorney’s fees for construction projects and even to pave roads near schools.

https://www.wgrz.com/...

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Whimsical 2 points 3 years ago

Before all the apes nonsense, this was where people would learn what "fungible" means

Wish it were for something less depressing

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Camzing 2 points 3 years ago

Sounds like fraud 😁

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Damaskox 1 point 3 years ago

Out of curiosity: What is considered illegal gambling?

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DeepFriedDresden 16 points 3 years ago

Gambling that is prohibited by local laws.

Each state has its own restrictions and laws so really it depends on your location.

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Camzing 11 points 3 years ago

When the government doesn't control it.

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JJROKCZ 4 points 3 years ago

Any gambling that isn’t regularly audited and controlled by the state. I work in the casino industry, I have sets of reports and evidence I have to run and provide to the state daily, weekly, monthly, quarterly, and annually. Then every two years they get a room in our building to full audit everything again end comb through everything we do to make sure we comply with all of the hundreds of controls across the 25 chapters in our gaming control book. Anything not subjected to and complying with that is illegal.

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theywilleatthestars 55 points 3 years ago

Wait til you find out about inheritance

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Lexam 47 points 3 years ago

It is a deep and philosophical question that must be looked at from all sides. But after much debate and consideration among our greatest scholars the universal truth is a question in of itself. Am I the random person?

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darcy 4 points 3 years ago

if you buy a ticket, you just might be !

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redballooon 39 points 3 years ago

If someone inherits a billion dollar, how is that not just given to a random person?

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Honytawk 8 points 3 years ago

If their family is that rich, they usually have gotten some money of it before the other died.

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wombatula 4 points 3 years ago

Chances are the person who inherits a billion dollars is already used to dealing with large amounts of money, and likely has the support structure of accountants and advisors that will help them deal with it.

A lottery winner is usually middle-class or lower, the type of person whose life would be changed by a few thousand dollars, and likely has no idea how to manage wealth of that size.

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LinkOpensChest_wav 37 points 3 years ago

It's not as grotesque as the mundane realities that we accept as normal under capitalism

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FarceMultiplier 27 points 3 years ago

Far better than the shitheads that add nothing to the world and become billionaires through financial manipulation and employee exploitation.

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pdxfed 8 points 3 years ago

Seriously, 1.2b a drop in the ocean compared to generationally wealthy who leech off of society paying almost no tax by extending tax liability to infinity through gifting and buying politicians who create loopholes for them.

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Critical_Insight -2 points 3 years ago

I can't think of a single person who became a billionaire, yet added nothing of a value to the world. Sure they may have manipulated and exploited while at it, but there's still usually a product of some sort in the end, and the fact that they became wealthy indicates there was demand for said product.

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Honytawk 4 points 3 years ago

If someone adds value to the world, but does so through exploitation of the workforce, scamming their customers, or tax evasion. They didn't actually add anything to the world. They are net negative.

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redballooon 0 points 3 years ago

That’s an argument for the product, but the system still promotes shitheads to the heads of the companies that deliver said products.

And that still means shitheads are shitheads, regardless of the amount of money they have.

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FarceMultiplier 0 points 3 years ago

Net negative matters.

I could, for example, kill every animal in the forest then claim how good it is that the plants grew so much that year without so many things eating them. In the long run, it's very negative however.

Same for billionaires. You could say how great it is that we have electric cars, but who gets hurt and could it have been done without harm to people or society?

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derf82 24 points 3 years ago

First of all, they are not getting $1.2B. The lump sum cash value is $551.7M. The usually reported jackpots are presented in terms of the value of a 30 year annuity.

Second, those winnings are before taxes. After taxes, depending on the state, the person will walk away with $280m-350m.

Now, sure, that is still an absurd amount, but still like 1/4th the stated jackpot.

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Camzing 2 points 3 years ago

That's more reasonable.

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meco03211 9 points 3 years ago

Also most lottery winners end up dead or bankrupt within a few years of winning.

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Bilbo 7 points 3 years ago path: 0 4138375 4138499 4138715 4140616, hotness: undefined, score: 7, children: 1
meco03211 2 points 3 years ago

Dunno if it's bad for mobile or just a bad link but I got a 404.

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Camzing 2 points 3 years ago

I guess that's my point

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Kit 19 points 3 years ago

I think it's somewhat charming tbh. Everyone gets a tiny, miniscule chance of never having to work again. I rarely buy a ticket, but when I do I spend all week imagining all the fun things I'd do with the money.

As the other poster said, though, it's sad when folks get addicted to it.

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Camzing 0 points 3 years ago

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Kirkkh 18 points 3 years ago
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OceanSoap 15 points 3 years ago

It's because most people who win don't have good habits with money, and they don't know how to keep their mouth shut. They tell people, and they spend it frivolously.

You find out fast if your friends or family love you or not.

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wombatula 3 points 3 years ago

I mean the very fact that they are spending money on the lottery tells me that chances are they have bad spending habits.

And please, you, yes you, the person that buys lottery tickets and feels the need to explain to me how it's ok, we get it you're built different and aren't addicted or whatever, but there are still so many better things you could be spending it on.

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Silentiea 6 points 3 years ago

"voluntary tax on the poor"

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callouscomic 1 point 3 years ago

You sound like a recent Econ grad wielding little fun facts you learned to throw in peoples faces. Unnecessarily judgmental. People waste money on all kinds of things every day. It's not a problem if it isn't being done to inappropriate levels.

Hurr durr tax on the poor.

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WhiteHawk 4 points 3 years ago

Spending money on something that is less likey to return a profit than it is to get hit by lightning isn't exactly an indicator of financial literacy, tbf.

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Socsa 2 points 3 years ago

The lottery is literally a regressive tax both in concept and practice and I'm not really sure how you can view it any other way.

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wombatula -1 points 3 years ago

Ok but you sound like an asshole trying to belittle someone for the most basic facts. I love how you talk down and try and frame me as a youth, guessing you're either pretty young yourself or need to stop with pathetic ageism personal attacks instead of debating the subject.

Also I guarantee you buy lottery tickets and are mad at the second paragraph, stay mad salty kid, spend your retirement fund on little pieces of paper.

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Globulart -1 points 3 years ago

I'm sure there are 100 things you spend money on that we could say the same for.

Jesus, people act like it's impossible to play the lottery without ruining your life.

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phillaholic 2 points 3 years ago

It's possible to do hard drugs and not ruin your life too, but I wouldn't suggest it.

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wombatula 1 point 3 years ago
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Socsa -1 points 3 years ago

You can stop any time and prove them wrong

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guacupado 10 points 3 years ago

I may act different if I actually saw half a billion dollars in my account but I would I'd buy a house and car for each family member, save 20mil to live off the interest, and then donate the rest towards projects like spine repair medicine or desalination or something. Or maybe buy a shitload of solar panels for homes.

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kryllic 13 points 3 years ago

How about lending your old pal kryllic a couple of bucks?

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Olhonestjim 6 points 3 years ago

And that's why it sucks.

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Sukisuki -1 points 3 years ago

it is weird how people say that getting a lot of money, the thing whole world is based on, all humans work every day to get, is the worst thing that happened to them.

Shakespeare - shot by someone who was trying to get his money

David Lee Edwards - was a convict, spent a lot in several years, lost all his money and died.

Jeffree Dampier: was sleeping with his wife's sister, shot and killed by her and her husband.

Urooj Khan: coughs blood and dies the next day of getting his check. Cyanide poisoning.

Michael Karoll: "parties, coke, hookers, cars"

Harrell Jr: spent too much, lent too much, killed himself after his wife left him.

Stories go on and on. Almost all of them can be linked to already unstable, unwell people, their inability to manage the money properly or them not shutting up about the huge cash pile they recently sat on, to the trashy, money crazed people around them.

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paddirn 15 points 3 years ago

They should split it up into $100,000 increments. Yeah, that's not a billion, but that could still be life-changing for thousands of families.

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Ya_Boy_Skinny_Penis 5 points 3 years ago

That's not how lotteries work.

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Jud_R 1 point 3 years ago

In the UK, you can take a lump sum or instalments just like this . Infact your get more if you take the instalments.

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mtdyson_01 10 points 3 years ago

Then you'll feel better knowing that in the US that whomever wins that Powerball will end up with less than half the amount they won. Taxes will eat up about 60% of the winnings .

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mangosloth 8 points 3 years ago

And then, statistically, their life will be ruined so... Grotesque indeed

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mtdyson_01 9 points 3 years ago

I would be willing to fall on that sword for the unlucky soul that wins that lottery. I actually knew someone that won the 10 million publishers clearance house back in the 1980's. Classic story of they were dirt poor before the win and dirt poorer about 5 years after the win. Banks lined up to give them loans and they took them all since the prize didn't pay out in a lump sum. After the interest their yearly checks and more were gone... But they had "stuff" for awhile.

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wombatula 1 point 3 years ago

And of course the US government only does cool and awesome things with that money that everybody in the country benefits from.

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Usernameblankface 10 points 3 years ago

The entire idea of a statewide lottery seems awful to me. I think there should be a cap on the size and reach of any one lottery. It's been shown to be more harmful than helpful to dump millions of dollars on one person's bank account.

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Semi-Hemi-Demigod 8 points 3 years ago

San Francisco spends $700 million a year dealing with their roughly 7,000 unhoused people. They could just give every one of them $100,000 a year and spend less, and probably have better results.

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Honytawk 4 points 3 years ago

Pretty sure that if they didn't spend 700 million, there would be quite a lot more than 7000 unhoused people.

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gurmif -3 points 3 years ago

No they couldn't. If being homeless paid six figures there would suddenly be a lot more homeless people.

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blindbunny 2 points 3 years ago

Considering how many of their lives go off the rails, yes.

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rebul 1 point 3 years ago
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kSPvhmTOlwvMd7Y7E 0 points 3 years ago

There should be a cap on maximum wealth / revenu

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TimewornTraveler 0 points 3 years ago

The public opinions on Lemmy are fucking daffy. So on top of everything else, yall are cool with predatory gambling system that randomly ruins one person's life?

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ook_the_librarian 5 points 3 years ago

By saying you're not "cool" with the lottery, does that mean you want it abolished? I don't like the lottery. I don't think it should be outlawed. Would you classify me as either cool with it or daffy?

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TimewornTraveler -2 points 3 years ago

Certainly less daffy than the people playing it or praising it. I don't know your reason why you think a state function that harms people for money should be allowed to exist, but I'm guessing it's not a very rational one.

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null 2 points 3 years ago

Help me out, who's life is being ruined?

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TimewornTraveler 1 point 3 years ago

check out the mortality rate of lottery winners, or other outcomes

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null 2 points 3 years ago

Just did and got a bunch of conflicting information. Do you have a source?

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tallwookie -8 points 3 years ago
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LarryTheMatador 5 points 3 years ago
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DigitalPaperTrail 6 points 3 years ago
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LarryTheMatador 2 points 3 years ago
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MedicPigBabySaver 1 point 3 years ago

Potahayto

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Syll 1 point 3 years ago

Boil em, mash em, stick em in a stew

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Camzing 1 point 3 years ago

Carrot

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rynzcycle 1 point 3 years ago
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theodewere -11 points 3 years ago

it is completely ridiculous, all lotteries should be outlawed

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Rivalarrival 2 points 3 years ago

Most states have a 50% payout, with the other 50% going to schools and other public works. So, every time someone wins a lottery, the general public also wins that lottery.

I'm perfectly happy with a voluntary tax on people who are bad at math. I don't want lotteries outlawed. I want them expanded. I think we should make lottery tickets (partially) tax deductible. I think there is an argument to be made that if lottery earnings are considered income, lottery tickets should be considered an expense. The state is going to end up with half that money anyway; I think $0.50 on the dollar should be tax deductible.

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theodewere 0 points 3 years ago

it's all accounting bullshit.. paying for schools with gambling money is weak and corrupt.. we have the money to pay for schools without it.. we like to pass the responsibility off to someone else, that's all.. and when you think about it, a voluntary tax on the uneducated to pay for schools isn't real bright, is it..

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Rivalarrival 3 points 3 years ago

There is nothing noble about taking money from people who want to keep it, and/or refusing it from people who want to give it.

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