))<>((

3 years ago by fossilesque to c/science_memes

rockerface 219 points 3 years ago

As a software developer, the less ambiguous your notation is, the better it is for everyone involved. Not only will I use brackets, I'll split my expression into multiple rows and use tabs to make it as readable as humanly possible. And maybe throw a comment or 2 if there's still some black magic involved

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Mikufan 80 points 3 years ago

No just write the entire code in one line totally perfect.

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rockerface 37 points 3 years ago

Calm down, Satan

path: 0 9067161 9067246 9067617, hotness: undefined, score: 37, children: 3
Mikufan 30 points 3 years ago

"don't worry, you just need this simple one-liner to fix your project"

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Morphit 20 points 3 years ago

The one-liner: *parses HTML with a regex*

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zqwzzle 7 points 3 years ago path: 0 9067161 9067246 9069049, hotness: undefined, score: 7, children: 7
Bandicoot_Academic 10 points 3 years ago

For some context this is one of the winning entries:

#include <stdio.h>

#define N(a) "%"#a"$hhn" #define O(a,b) "%10$"#a"d"N(b) #define U "%10$.*37$d" #define G(a) "%"#a"$s" #define H(a,b) G(a)G(b) #define T(a) a a #define s(a) T(a)T(a) #define A(a) s(a)T(a)a #define n(a) A(a)a #define D(a) n(a)A(a) #define C(a) D(a)a #define R C(C(N(12)G(12))) #define o(a,b,c) C(H(a,a))D(G(a))C(H(b,b)G(b))n(G(b))O(32,c)R #define SS O(78,55)R "\n\033[2J\n%26$s"; #define E(a,b,c,d) H(a,b)G(c)O(253,11)R G(11)O(255,11)R H(11,d)N(d)O(253,35)R #define S(a,b) O(254,11)H(a,b)N(68)R G(68)O(255,68)N(12)H(12,68)G(67)N(67)

char* fmt = O(10,39)N(40)N(41)N(42)N(43)N(66)N(69)N(24)O(22,65)O(5,70)O(8,44)N( 45)N(46)N (47)N(48)N( 49)N( 50)N( 51)N(52)N(53 )O( 28, 54)O(5, 55) O(2, 56)O(3,57)O( 4,58 )O(13, 73)O(4, 71 )N( 72)O (20,59 )N(60)N(61)N( 62)N (63)N (64)R R E(1,2, 3,13 )E(4, 5,6,13)E(7,8,9 ,13)E(1,4 ,7,13)E (2,5,8, 13)E( 3,6,9,13)E(1,5, 9,13)E(3 ,5,7,13 )E(14,15, 16,23) E(17,18,19,23)E( 20, 21, 22,23)E (14,17,20,23)E(15, 18,21,23)E(16,19, 22 ,23)E( 14, 18, 22,23)E(16,18,20, 23)R U O(255 ,38)R G ( 38)O( 255,36) R H(13,23)O(255, 11)R H(11,36) O(254 ,36) R G( 36 ) O( 255,36)R S(1,14 )S(2,15)S(3, 16)S(4, 17 )S (5, 18)S(6, 19)S(7,20)S(8, 21)S(9 ,22)H(13,23 )H(36, 67 )N(11)R G(11)""O(255, 25 )R s(C(G(11) ))n (G( 11) )G( 11)N(54)R C( "aa") s(A( G(25)))T (G(25))N (69)R o (14,1,26)o( 15, 2, 27)o (16,3,28 )o( 17,4, 29)o(18 ,5,30)o(19 ,6,31)o( 20,7,32)o (21,8,33)o (22 ,9, 34)n(C(U) )N( 68)R H( 36,13)G(23) N(11)R C(D( G(11))) D(G(11))G(68)N(68)R G(68)O(49,35)R H(13,23)G(67)N(11)R C(H(11,11)G( 11))A(G(11))C(H(36,36)G(36))s(G(36))O(32,58)R C(D(G(36)))A(G(36))SS

#define arg d+6,d+8,d+10,d+12,d+14,d+16,d+18,d+20,d+22,0,d+46,d+52,d+48,d+24,d
+26,d+28,d+30,d+32,d+34,d+36,d+38,d+40,d+50,(scanf(d+126,d+4),d+(6
-2)+18*(1-d[2]%2)+d[4]*2),d,d+66,d+68,d+70, d+78,d+80,d+82,d+90,d+
92,d+94,d+97,d+54,d[2],d+2,d+71,d+77,d+83,d+89,d+95,d+72,d+73,d+74
,d+75,d+76,d+84,d+85,d+86,d+87,d+88,d+100,d+101,d+96,d+102,d+99,d+
67,d+69,d+79,d+81,d+91,d+93,d+98,d+103,d+58,d+60,d+98,d+126,d+127,
d+128,d+129

char d[538] = {1,0,10,0,10};

int main() { while(*d) printf(fmt, arg); }

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FreshLight 8 points 3 years ago

I tried to read that out loud and summoned something. Please help me, I'm scared.

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Swedneck 6 points 3 years ago

this straight up looks like a chemical formula

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blanketswithsmallpox 3 points 3 years ago

If I cross my eyes hard enough on mobile... I imagine I can see dickbutt in there somewhere...

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dejected_warp_core 5 points 3 years ago

Further up the thread, someone mentioned that writing good software is about communicating concepts to people, first and foremost.

This, code obfuscation, is what it looks like to communicate exclusively to the compiler instead.

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CommissarVulpin 6 points 3 years ago

Excel has entered the chat

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Mic_Check_One_Two 13 points 3 years ago

For real though, I have written some truly monstrous operations in Excel.

What do you mean you want to use Excel to manage everyone’s calendars? And now you want to export that horribly built calendar management spreadsheet to Google Calendar? What do you mean you want the Google Calendar entries automatically formatted based on who is working on a particular day? I mean yes it’s possible but-…

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CommissarVulpin 2 points 3 years ago

VBA has made things so, so much easier since I started learning how to use it.

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MigratingApe 3 points 3 years ago

Well, this is exactly what mathematicians do.

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dustyData 65 points 3 years ago

As a professor said, most programming languages don't care about readability and whitespace. But we care because humans need it to parse meaning. Thus, write code for people, not for the machine. Always assume that someone with no knowledge of the context will have to debug it, and be kind to them. Because that someone might be you in six months when you have completely forgotten how the code works.

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zalgotext 18 points 3 years ago

Exactly. You read code way more times than you write it, so it makes all the sense in the world to prioritize readability.

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Swedneck 13 points 3 years ago

Source code is for humans, then the compiler turns it into code for machines.

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oce 7 points 3 years ago

Python forcing end of line and tabs kinda does. Add Black auto-formatter and it's pretty good.

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frezik 1 point 3 years ago

I've seen too many Python devs write out complex statements all on one crammed up line. Including some that are in the main docs.

Enforced whitespace is just one aspect of readable code. There are many others, and Python is no better at enforcing those than any other language.

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oce 2 points 3 years ago

That would probably make very long lines and black would automatically add returns to line with proper indentations. But it has a a limit for sure. If you chain many list comprehensions it's going to be a mess.

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rockerface 6 points 3 years ago

Yep, if you're writing code for a machine, just do it in binary to save compilation time (/s just in case). Also, you in six months will indeed be someone with no knowledge of the context. And every piece of code you think you write for one-time use is guaranteed to be reused every day for the next 5 years

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Mic_Check_One_Two 20 points 3 years ago

And every piece of code you think you write for one-time use is guaranteed to be reused every day for the next 5 years

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feinstruktur 5 points 3 years ago

This. Always be kind to your future self.

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snowsuit2654 2 points 3 years ago

Yeah I totally agree. You can minimize and optimize as part of your build procedure/compilation but the source code should be as readable as possible for humans.

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Quetzalcutlass 58 points 3 years ago

I had someone submit a pull request recently that, in addition to their actual changes, also removed every single parenthesis that wasn't strictly necessary in a file full of 3D math functions. I know it was probably the fault of an autoformatter they used, but I was still the most offended I've ever been at a pull request.

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rockerface 28 points 3 years ago

Autoformatter? More like obfuscator

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MotoAsh 9 points 3 years ago
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penquin 2 points 3 years ago
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neidu2 1 point 3 years ago

As someone who used to code in Lisp, I'm all for excessive paranthesis use.

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stebo02 0 points 3 years ago
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mathic 29 points 3 years ago

I, my head, shake.

  • RPN user
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rockerface 6 points 3 years ago

Also known as: Japanese speaker

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unexposedhazard 27 points 3 years ago

Also works if you dont trust yourself with correctly ordering your operations.

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ASeriesOfPoorChoices 24 points 3 years ago

back and forth, forever.

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RinseDrizzle 1 point 3 years ago

Suuuuuch a weird movie lol

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Qkall 23 points 3 years ago path: 0 9067541, hotness: undefined, score: 23, children: 6
PoisonedPrisonPanda 3 points 3 years ago

Ok man. Wtf did I just watch...

I get it. We are here on the somehow dark side of the internet..

But THIS.... without any context. i mean. Im questioning live here man. What do you want to express with that?

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janNatan 10 points 3 years ago

I'm pretty sure it's just a reference to when the kid types ))<>((

Btw, it's not from the dark side of the Internet. This was a very popular video at the time.

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trslim 1 point 3 years ago

My husband showed me that video last night. It was very strange.

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Qkall 2 points 3 years ago

Somehow that clip is better than the fairly odd movie. I don't think I could recommend it... But I think of the clip posted all the time. It's so weird πŸ˜‚. Some how they figured out creepy, funny, and somehow wholesome at once.

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ASeriesOfPoorChoices 1 point 3 years ago

πŸ€¦β€β™‚οΈ read the post body, my lad.

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PoisonedPrisonPanda 1 point 3 years ago

Thanks. Im blind AF

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SmoothLiquidation 17 points 3 years ago

This is why every calculator should be a RPN calculator.

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lemmyng 5 points 3 years ago

I still have my HP 48 series calculator. It's a sturdy beast.

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SmartmanApps -2 points 3 years ago

This is why every calculator should be a RPN calculator

No, this is why programmers should (re)learn the order of operations rules before writing a calculator.

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Voyajer 11 points 3 years ago

Improved readability is always good

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MotoAsh 11 points 3 years ago
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DragonTypeWyvern 7 points 3 years ago

Internalized PEMDAS without knowing it's literally the same thing as BODMAS is exactly the problem!

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strawberry 3 points 3 years ago

what in the name of fuck is BODMAS

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TheOakTree 4 points 3 years ago

Same as PEMDAS, except:

Parentheses -> Bracket

Exponent -> Order

Multiplication <-> Division

BODMAS

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MystikIncarnate 2 points 3 years ago

I learned it as "BEDMAS"

Brackets

Exponents

(You can guess the rest)

But when I learned BEDMAS, my teacher directed us to do implied multiplication before other multiplication/division. Which, as far as I'm aware, is mathematically correct according to the proper order of operations (instead of whatever acronym summary you learned).

Before I get "umm. Acktually"d .... I know that's not the full picture of the order of operations as it should be in mathematics. But for the limited scope I learned of algebra from highschool, AFAIK, this is correct to the point that I have understanding of. I'm not a mathematician, and I work with computers all day long and they do the math for me when I need to do any of it. So higher understanding in my case is not helpful.

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strawberry 1 point 3 years ago

order? how does that make sense? brackets alright ig

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MotoAsh -1 points 3 years ago
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SmartmanApps -1 points 3 years ago

The exact problem is math is not taught correctly

Every single Maths textbook I've seen teaches it correctly. The issue is people not remembering what they were taught (and then programming a calculator without checking it first). Calculators

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MonkderDritte 3 points 3 years ago

So better do higher math in Python? I agree.

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MotoAsh 1 point 3 years ago
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MonkderDritte 1 point 3 years ago

But a quite common pl in science.

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dejected_warp_core 2 points 3 years ago

Also: sometimes, a mathematician just has to invent some concept or syntax to convey something unconventional. The specific use of subscript/superscript, whatever 'phi' is being used for, etc. on whatever paper you're reading doesn't have to correlate to how other work uses the same concepts. It's bad form, but sometimes its needed, and if useful enough is added to the general canon of what we call "math". Meanwhile, you can encapsulate and obfuscate things in software, sure, but you can always get down to the bedrock of what the language supports; there's no inventing anything new.

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MotoAsh 2 points 3 years ago
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SmartmanApps -1 points 3 years ago

Math should be just as deterministic as programming, but it’s not in some situations

Maths is 100% deterministic for order of operations. The issue is people not following all of the rules. Order of operations thread index

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MotoAsh 0 points 3 years ago
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itsralC 2 points 3 years ago

Counterpoint: C function pointers (or just C in general)

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MeDuViNoX 11 points 3 years ago

(β€Ώ!β€Ώ) (β€ΏOβ€Ώ)

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The_Cunt_of_Monte_Cristo 5 points 3 years ago

( . ) ( . ) ( . Y . )

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FatTony 7 points 3 years ago

My calculator says -2Β² = -4, so yeah...

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ByGourou 7 points 3 years ago

Isn't the "-" order of operations the same as a multiply ? I think I learned powers take priority over the "-" so your calculator would be right.
But either way if it can cause confusion you should use parentheses.

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TonyTonyChopper 3 points 3 years ago

Every calculator I've used has separate negative and subtraction keys for this purpose. There is no order of operations to follow, it's just a squaring a number

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ByGourou 3 points 3 years ago

I learned negative as being a separate operation where we need to apply the order of operations. I think it was something like : -2 is a diminutive for -1x2 so it uses the order of operations of a multiplication.
My calculator is the official one used in schools in France (ti-83 premium ce) and it says -2^2 = -4 with the negative key. I don't think it would make a mistake in such a simple concept.

But whatever these concepts can change depending on the field, country, level of education. What I mean is : it's unclear, so use parentheses. So (-2)^2 or -(2^2) are the correct ways to write it.

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SmartmanApps 2 points 3 years ago

I think it was something like : -2 is a diminutive for -1x2

Correct. Things that are usually left out of Maths expressions are plus signs, ones as multipliers/indices, and un-needed brackets. e.g. I could more fully write this as -1(4)Β², but that just simplifies to -4Β²

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SmartmanApps -1 points 3 years ago

it’s just a squaring a number

The number being squared is 4, unless you put (-4)Β², otherwise it's 4Β² with a minus sign.

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SmartmanApps 1 point 3 years ago

I think I learned powers take priority over the β€œ-”

Yes, Exponents is the 2nd-highest precedence (after Brackets) - BEDMAS.

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Ultraviolet 3 points 3 years ago

I would never write -nΒ². Either ‐(nΒ²) or (-n)Β². Order of operations shouldn't be some sort of gotcha to trick people into misinterpreting you, it's the intuitive reading of a well constructed mathematical expression.

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SmartmanApps -2 points 3 years ago

Either ‐(nΒ²) or (-n)Β². Order of operations shouldn’t be some sort of gotcha to trick people into misinterpreting you

It isn't. With ‐(nΒ²), nΒ² is already a single term, so the brackets aren't needed.

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SmartmanApps 2 points 3 years ago

My calculator says -2Β² = -4

That's correct

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Lemmy_Cook 5 points 3 years ago

I feel this in my bones

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ooli 5 points 3 years ago
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SmartmanApps 2 points 3 years ago

I just used the calc on window… it cannot respect order of operation

Yeah, I've tried several times to get Microsoft to fix their calculators. I've given up trying now - eventually you have to stop banging your head against the wall.

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lolcatnip 5 points 3 years ago

I've never seen a calculator that had bracket keys but didn't implement the conventional order of operations.

But anyway, I'm on Team RPN.

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isolatedscotch 9 points 3 years ago

my dumb ass reading this: "Team rock paper nscissors"

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lolcatnip 2 points 3 years ago

RTS = rock taper scissors
FPS = frock paper scissors

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masterspace 5 points 3 years ago path: 0 9079044 9080746, hotness: undefined, score: 5, children: 5
SmartmanApps 0 points 3 years ago path: 0 9079044 9080746 9131678, hotness: undefined, score: 0, children: 0
lolcatnip 0 points 3 years ago

Ah, I wasn't thinking of calculators that let you type in a full expression. When I was in school, only fancy graphing calculators had that feature. A typical scientific calculator didn't have juxtaposition, so you'd have to enter 6Γ·2(1+2) as 6Γ·2Γ—(1+2), and you'd get 9 as the answer because Γ· and Γ— have equal precedence and just go left to right.

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SmartmanApps 0 points 3 years ago

A typical scientific calculator didn’t have juxtaposition, so you’d have to enter 6Γ·2(1+2) as 6Γ·2Γ—(1+2)

That's not true

you’d get 9 as the answer because Γ· and Γ— have equal precedence and just go left to right

Well, more precisely you broke up the single term 2(1+2) into 2 terms - 2 and (1+2) - when you inserted the multiplication symbol, which sends the (1+2) from being in the denominator to being in the numerator. Terms are separated by operators and joined by grouping symbols.

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lolcatnip 0 points 3 years ago

I'm not sure what you're getting at with your source. I'm taking about physical, non-graphic scientific calculators from the 1990s.

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SmartmanApps 0 points 3 years ago

I’ve never seen a calculator that had bracket keys but didn’t implement the conventional order of operations.

I've seen plenty

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Kowowow 3 points 3 years ago

Ooh I love brackets

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EunieIsTheBus 3 points 3 years ago

I recall that there is a myriad of memes of the form 'what is 4-2*3' under which there is always a never ending discussion of confidently incorrect dumbasses denying the existence of the multiplication before addition rule.

So your suspicion is at least not unreasonable

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SmartmanApps 2 points 3 years ago

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ArcticAmphibian 3 points 3 years ago

$((A+B))

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Jakylla 3 points 3 years ago

Gotta use Lisp notation to be sure

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seriousconsideration 3 points 3 years ago

Or, you know, you could simplify the terms?

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Daxtron2 12 points 3 years ago

sounds like work for a compooter

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7heo 2 points 3 years ago

(> (explicit) (implicit))

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spongeborgcubepants 1 point 3 years ago

Is the title a Requiem for a Dream reference?

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SmartmanApps 1 point 3 years ago path: 0 9132824, hotness: undefined, score: 1, children: 0
unlucky 1 point 3 years ago

me using sbcl for everything

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science_memes
science_memes

@mander.xyz

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Welcome to c/science_memes @ Mander.xyz!

A place for majestic STEMLORD peacocking, as well as memes about the realities of working in a lab.



Rules

  1. Don't throw mud. Behave like an intellectual and remember the human.
  2. Keep it rooted (on topic).
  3. No spam.
  4. Infographics welcome, get schooled.


Research Committee

Other Mander Communities

Science and Research

Biology and Life Sciences

Physical Sciences

Humanities and Social Sciences

Practical and Applied Sciences

Memes

Miscellaneous

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