Xi and Mao replace Jesus and Mary in Chinese churches

2 years ago by lemme in to c/world

Christians face harassment and disruption in Beijing crackdown on religion, US government agency reports

In their effort to “exert total control” over religion and to “sinicise” Catholic and Protestant Christianity, the authorities have “ordered the removal of crosses from churches [and] replaced images of Jesus Christ or the Virgin Mary with pictures of President Xi Jinping,” the report said.

The report concluded that “every facet of religious life for Buddhists, Catholics and Protestant Christians, Muslims, and Taoists” was facing pressure to incorporate CCP ideology, and religious elements considered contradictory to the state’s political agenda were being eradicated.

IMNOTCRAZYINSTITUTION 126 points 2 years ago

the spectre of communism immaculately impregnated mao, who gave birth to xi.

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Aurenkin 57 points 2 years ago

The holy Xinity

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acosmichippo 16 points 2 years ago

the father son and holy ghost

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jaybone 12 points 2 years ago

The father, the son, the Winnie the Pooh.

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Henry 5 points 2 years ago
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Eyck_of_denesle 1 point 2 years ago

You are obsessed

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PugJesus 75 points 2 years ago

Hey, finally, a religion tankies are comfortable with!

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tal 39 points 2 years ago

Upon further consideration, it was decided that perhaps what Marx had meant was that certain varieties of opium were, in fact, good for the people.

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jmcs 9 points 2 years ago

That's not even a Chinese innovation. At least the Chinese gave Mao a proper burial instead of desecrating his corpse Christian saint/Lenin style.

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NoneOfUrBusiness 50 points 2 years ago

What the actual fuck???

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tal 20 points 2 years ago

Honestly, concerns over the possibility that religion might be a political opponent and trying to neutralize it by replacing figures with one's own are not new.

It's just a little unusual to have it happening in 2024 between gods and secular leaders.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_syncretism

Religious syncretism is the blending of religious belief systems into a new system, or the incorporation of other beliefs into an existing religious tradition.

This can occur for many reasons, where religious traditions exist in proximity to each other, or when a culture is conquered and the conquerors bring their religious beliefs with them, but do not succeed in eradicating older beliefs and practices.

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kent_eh 3 points 2 years ago

concerns over the possibility that religion might be a political opponent and trying to neutralize it by replacing figures with one's own are not new.

It's been a pretty common thing that dictators have done throughout recorded history.

It's not about agreeing or disagreeing with the specifics of the church, it's about eliminating divided loyalties.

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Maggoty 20 points 2 years ago

Same shit, different century. Ever look up the actual history of Christmas or Easter? They were pagan holidays and Christian rulers forced everyone to jam as much Christian stuff into them as they could.

It's literally one of the oldest tricks in the book.

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418_im_a_teapot 19 points 2 years ago

Are you surprised???

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NoneOfUrBusiness 10 points 2 years ago

More flabbergasted, really.

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StraponStratos 45 points 2 years ago

Maohammed when?

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NoneOfUrBusiness 18 points 2 years ago

As a Muslim this is one of the times I'm glad paintings of humans and animals are haram in Islam. We don't got none of that shit in mosques (or anywhere else, really).

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TankovayaDiviziya 8 points 2 years ago path: 0 12740457 12742662 12745734, hotness: undefined, score: 8, children: 1
NoneOfUrBusiness 3 points 2 years ago

I mean yes, but that only violates the sanctity of these mosques, which is to be fair a fucking atrocity as far as Islam is concerned. They are, however, unable to violate Islam itself, is what I'm trying to say.

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Cyberjin 6 points 2 years ago
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Maalus -10 points 2 years ago

That's like saying "catholics are a bit sensitive when it comes to eating meat on fridays". It's a nonsense statement

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Cyberjin 12 points 2 years ago
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Danquebec 10 points 2 years ago

I think Muslims take this more seriously because, as someone who grew up in a region where most people identified Catholic (and most of the rest just had no religion) but didn't practice much, I wasn't even aware of that rule.

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Saleh 6 points 2 years ago

Also Islam rejects intercessors. We pray to Allah s.w.t. and only to him. We asked for forgiveness for our sins from him and him alone. The prophets and messangers a.s. were all humans of best character and faith, which is why they were honored but also challenged with their tasks.

This is why countries like China are particularly oppressive towards Islam. The faith is structured in a way that makes it more difficult to coopt it into exerting control over people for a government. Unfortunately we see (partly) successfull attempts at it like in Saudi Arabia. But they also control two of the holyest sites with Meqqa and Medina.

If i understand correctly China is oppressing Buddhism more strongly too because it is also not well controllable. But i have to admit that i know little about the details of buddhist spirituality/religion.

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lemmee_in 4 points 2 years ago

Most religions in China get the same treatment from the CCP.

Christian communities have had similar experiences.

In 2016, thousands of crosses were torn down from churches throughout Zhejiang Province. The authorities have also broken up congregations that have not been approved by the state, while church leaders have been arrested and jailed.

The demolition of domes, crosses and minarets and their replacement by Chinese-styled tiled roofs and Buddhist-styled pagodas. It involves mandatory patriotic education for Buddhist, Christian and Muslim clergy and it entails party-approved sermons and prayers.

South of Xinjiang in Tibet, the authorities have restricted the practice of Tibetan Buddhism over the last decade. Religious festivals have been banned more frequently and government employees, teachers and students have been barred from participating in religious activities.

https://www.aljazeera.com/...

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friendlymessage 2 points 2 years ago

There are many more examples than just Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan comes to mind but also many other Muslim countries use Islam and Shari'a law to control the population or use religious laws as an excuse for their authoritarianism. No religion is free of that.

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vin 2 points 2 years ago

Rejecting intercessors has not worked out, has it? See Sunni vs Shia.

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NoneOfUrBusiness 1 point 2 years ago

I mean 80% of Muslims are Sunni so it has worked out to a large extent.

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phar -2 points 2 years ago

That's one of the dumber things I've heard today. Luckily it's still early, plenty more dumb stuff to read.

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NoneOfUrBusiness 1 point 2 years ago

Is this just militant atheism or are you trying to make some kind of point?

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discount_door_garlic 1 point 2 years ago

Whether they were condescending or not "militant athiesm" is a ridiculous hyperbole - people are free to believe whatever they want, just as anybody else is free to comment on that belief system when theyre not a part of it.

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phar 1 point 2 years ago

Neither? Being glad art is banned for any reason is dumb to me.

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CanadaPlus 33 points 2 years ago

An outrageous claim from the Telegraph. I need a second source.

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Fades -1 points 2 years ago

because China has always been oh so welcoming of other religions right? Sources are great but calling this an outrageous claim is a bit much given the historical context.

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CanadaPlus 31 points 2 years ago

I mean, it's a pretty big step from "we need to pre-approve priests" to "actually, your religion is about something completely different now".

And, more importantly, it's the Telegraph. If it was the Guardian I'd go "gee whiz, that's a whole new level, very unexpected".

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Womble -1 points 2 years ago

replaced images of Jesus Christ or the Virgin Mary with pictures of President Xi Jinping.

Its not saying actually Xi is your god now, its just making churches one more place where you see the dear leader. Still bad but not at the insane level of trying to rewrite one of the world's largest religions.

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emeralddawn45 7 points 2 years ago

I have a lot of doubts about this article, but also i bet i could find multiple instances of churches in certain states taking down pictures of jesus to put up pictures of trump.

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DragonTypeWyvern 1 point 2 years ago

This dude follows people into dark alleys for candy

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Squizzy -6 points 2 years ago

Why is the telegraph bad, I really like their journalists they have always come across well.

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CanadaPlus 10 points 2 years ago

Doesn't it have a reputation for being a tabloid?

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IndustryStandard 5 points 2 years ago

Generally they write anti brown people propaganda.

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match 3 points 2 years ago

other religions buddhism and taoism

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ohwhatfollyisman 31 points 2 years ago

she came into the manger, way overdue,

and plonked herself down next to the ewe.

then -- leaning back on the cow --

did she, the great chairman mao,

immaculately embirth winnie the pooh.

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Diplomjodler3 4 points 2 years ago

Don't give them ideas!

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residentmarchant 2 points 2 years ago

No, this would be a fun one to watch! Imagine them claiming that Xi is 2000+ yrs old and he just came to power....now?

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BlucifersVeinyAnus 24 points 2 years ago

Which one is Mary, and which Jesus?

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Annoyed_Crabby 23 points 2 years ago

Obviously Mao is Mary, giving birth to Xi the Jesus, that will be betrayed by his own government.

Can't say China is anti lgbt now as Mao Zhedong is trans all along.

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floofloof 13 points 2 years ago

Mother Mao-ry and little baby Xi-sus.

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Zer0_F0x 11 points 2 years ago

Mao Nodong

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tektite 1 point 2 years ago
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cyrano 19 points 2 years ago

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cyrano 15 points 2 years ago

Ai had difficulty to do a nativity scene without Mary 😀

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bcgm3 9 points 2 years ago

ಠ_ಠ

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cyrano 1 point 2 years ago

IYKYK 🤪

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Dainterhawk999 0 points 2 years ago

So techically these are Chinese sheeps, Chinese fodder, Chinese cloaks... A lot of things are coming to mind

A Chinese Mohammed A Chinese Jerusalem A Chinese Israel

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TokenBoomer 18 points 2 years ago

Found this:

While we found evidence of both the removal of crosses from churches and the replacement of holy images with that of Xi in China, we find that the reports on the replacement of holy images with Xi to be potentially misleading in some ways in the social media posts.

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Cowbee 6 points 2 years ago

"During the cold war, the anticommunist ideological framework could transform any data about existing communist societies into hostile evidence. If the Soviets refused to negotiate a point, they were intransigent and belligerent; if they appeared willing to make concessions, this was but a skillful ploy to put us off our guard. By opposing arms limitations, they would have demonstrated their aggressive intent; but when in fact they supported most armament treaties, it was because they were mendacious and manipulative. If the churches in the USSR were empty, this demonstrated that religion was suppressed; but if the churches were full, this meant the people were rejecting the regime's atheistic ideology. If the workers went on strike (as happened on infrequent occasions), this was evidence of their alienation from the collectivist system; if they didn't go on strike, this was because they were intimidated and lacked freedom. A scarcity of consumer goods demonstrated the failure of the economic system; an improvement in consumer supplies meant only that the leaders were attempting to placate a restive population and so maintain a firmer hold over them.

If communists in the United States played an important role struggling for the rights of workers, the poor, African-Americans, women, and others, this was only their guileful way of gathering support among disfranchised groups and gaining power for themselves. How one gained power by fighting for the rights of powerless groups was never explained. What we are dealing with is a nonfalsifiable orthodoxy, so assiduously marketed by the ruling interests that it affected people across the entire political spectrum."

-Michael Parenti, Blackshirts and Reds

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GoodEye8 1 point 2 years ago

The TLDR: Don't criticize China, you're wrong anyway.

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BigBenis 17 points 2 years ago

I need to see the nativity scene version of this! But with Xi's old face on baby Jesus.

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FarFarAway 17 points 2 years ago

I had to double check to see if this was an onion article.

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nickiwest 4 points 2 years ago

To be honest, I don't trust The Telegraph any more than I trust The Onion. At least The Onion is straightforward about what they are.

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barsquid 3 points 2 years ago

The Onion is quite accurate, they just publish too early.

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Gerudo 12 points 2 years ago

When I see tankie lemmings, I just point to this type of stuff....

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AwesomeLowlander 1 point 2 years ago

Does it help?

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Gerudo 1 point 2 years ago

Of course not, it's just like the Maga crowd. They have their heads in the sand just as bad.

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cecinestpasunbot 0 points 2 years ago

You point to poorly sourced telegraph articles and you expect to be taken seriously?

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tal 10 points 2 years ago

Hail, Mary Mao, full of grace,
the Lord is with thee.
Blessed art thou amongst women
and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus Xi.
Holy Mary Mao, Mother of God,
pray for us sinners,
now and at the hour of our death.
Amen.

Hail, Mary Mao, full of grace...

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technocrit 8 points 2 years ago path: 0 12747138, hotness: undefined, score: 8, children: 1
DragonTypeWyvern 1 point 2 years ago

There's a really good mod for Crusader Kings 2 where you play in a post-apocalypse America and one of the religion groups is Americanism, with the Founding Fathers as gods.

It's supposed to be a commentary on the concept of the American civil religion but it's mostly just awesome because NYC is still a Republic that follows one of the branches, and one of the starting families that rules Gotham is the Waynes :)

Reestablishing America as Batman wasn't quite what I expected from a CK2 mod but it was the best possible way to say goodbye to the system before CK3 dropped.

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TankovayaDiviziya 8 points 2 years ago

I watched "The Man in the High Castle", and the Christian imagery and symbolism in a former Christian Church were replaced with Nazi symbolism. I thought it was a bit farfetched, but now hearing something similar being done by China as part of totalitarianism, it is rather spooky. I've heard religious buildings being destroyed, but converting places of worship and blatantly removing its past to align with state ideology is far more surreal and haunting, and I am an agnostic atheist.

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captainlezbian 4 points 2 years ago path: 0 12744778 12749112, hotness: undefined, score: 4, children: 0
DragonTypeWyvern 3 points 2 years ago

The end goal of fascism, per Mussolini:

"All within the state, nothing outside the state, nothing against the state."

Fascism innately rejects the concept of the separation of powers and human rights alike.

If you view the traditional three pillars of heirarchy and power in a capitalist society as the state, the corporations, and the church, the absorbtion of both corporate and church power is simply the end goal. You might also ask "couldn't the corporate powers or churches effectively do the same thing by absorbing the others instead?"

Funnily enough, Hirohito and Japan had already effectively absorbed that pillar of power with State Shinto and the literal deification of the imperial line.

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captainlezbian 8 points 2 years ago

Religion is the opiate of the masses and the CCP insists on being the only dealer around

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Fontasia 7 points 2 years ago

This worked out great for Lenin and Stalin who just skipped the middle step and outlawed the church, then put their statues everywhere

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kent_eh 4 points 2 years ago

Dictators always do that.

And, not because they're atheists as the butthurt Christians so often claim.

It's all about centralized control and not allowing for divided loyalties or spaces for people to gather outside the party's control.

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MouseKeyboard 3 points 2 years ago

More often dictators take control of the church and use it for propaganda.

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AbsoluteChicagoDog 2 points 2 years ago
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Saleh 3 points 2 years ago

And slaughtered a lot of clerical people in the wake. There is a monastry where more than 1000 monks have been murdered under Stalins influence in Mongolia.

Overall tens of thousands of clerical people must have been murdered under Stalin

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friendlymessage 2 points 2 years ago

The Chinese approach is far more effective I fear. The Soviet way worked only with mixed results and was more ideology driven than logical. In Poland, the Catholic Church became a huge factor in the opposition because of that. If religion is deeply rooted in society, controlling and steering religion makes for a powerful tool to control the masses while fighting it automatically makes it a strong opposition force.

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Stalinwolf 7 points 2 years ago

I can't wait to go Christmaos Jinping this year! They just put in a new Target in the workers quarter.

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ZombiFrancis 3 points 2 years ago

The Americanization of China would be rather complete.

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Shard 6 points 2 years ago

Saint Winnie the Pooh

Seriously the onion can't keep up with reality.

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YeetPics 5 points 2 years ago

Lmao that's fucking hilarious.

NK levels of brain rot here we come!

Right on track to repeat the horrors of the past with complete blind faith in himself.

I can't wait to watch him fall on his face royally.

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SoJB 0 points 2 years ago

Keep waiting, bud.

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DragonTypeWyvern -1 points 2 years ago

Yeah say whatever you want about Xi's rapid descent into red fascism, his rule seems stable enough, and with how humans work it's going to stay that way as long as the economy keeps growing. And it WILL keep growing because that's just how industrialization works.

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drunkpostdisaster 5 points 2 years ago

I was so hoping to see pictures of mother Mao hold baby Xi

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Etterra 4 points 2 years ago

Replace Mary in the manger with Mao. Now Mao is giving birth to Jesus. Weirdo.

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FlyingSquid 7 points 2 years ago

Replace baby Jesus with adult Mao in the manger.

I wouldn't be able to stop laughing in that church.

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mwguy 3 points 2 years ago

Oh ya, it's time for Hot Xi Summer.

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Mwa 0 points 2 years ago

That is soo messed up

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Default_Defect -2 points 2 years ago

Managed to make religion more believable by replacing the made up with real people.

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GiveMemes 5 points 2 years ago

I mean if you really don't think there was a Jesus that existed, was popular, and was executed by the Roman empire, then I think you may be the mistaken one.

Saying that he wasn't the son of God and his mother wasn't a virgin is a different story however

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Default_Defect 5 points 2 years ago

Without the super powers, none of the rest matters.

The was a Saint Nicholas, doesn't mean there's a Santa Claus.

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GiveMemes 0 points 2 years ago

Okay, but Mao is treated like a pseudo-godlike figure in China, similar to how Jesus was a guy but is treated like a god by Christians.

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Default_Defect 1 point 2 years ago

Sure, but I know Mao existed. Son of God Jesus of Nazareth™ didn't exist. A Jesus that might have caused a ruckus back in the day is not the same thing as a born of a virgin demi-god.

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havocpants 3 points 2 years ago

Except there's no contemporaneous record of jesus either existing or being executed by the Romans, despite them keeping detailed records of people they did execute.

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Geobloke 1 point 2 years ago

It's a pretty high bar to expect bureaucratic details of people executed in a far flung part of the empire to survive 2000 years

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GiveMemes 0 points 2 years ago

That'd be true for the vast majority of figures from that time. Also I'd like to see evidence for your implied claim that apparently the Romans kept vast swathes of paperwork concerning executions and that the vast majority of it was preserved until this day.

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capital 2 points 2 years ago

I’m first in line to make fun of basically all religions (ones that would have you take things on faith, anyway) but those that want to should be left alone to practice how they want.

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lorty -6 points 2 years ago

Good thing all the sources are from US based institutions and NGOs. Must mean they are completely factual and unbiased.

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Eldritch 2 points 2 years ago

First that's attacking the messenger not the message. Cope. Second seeing how ML rely on information disproven nearly 100 years ago. And how ML state media is worse than western media on every metric. A true accomplishment! It's an especially sad and hilarious tactic.

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cecinestpasunbot 3 points 2 years ago

So if a known liar makes an unfalsifiable claim you think people should just take it as fact? That’s absurd.

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nutsack -8 points 2 years ago

I think this is good actually

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fritobugger2017 -8 points 2 years ago

While fucked up, at least Xi and Mao are nominally real (though their particular origin stories and revised histories are also just as made up as those of the religious bunch).

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dsilverz 1 point 2 years ago
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MediaBiasFactChecker -10 points 2 years ago path: 0 12739018, hotness: undefined, score: -10, children: 0
Henry -14 points 2 years ago

Let China dive this shits into Middle East countries’s mouth :)

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  • Rule 5: Keep it civil. It's OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It's NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

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  • Rule 7: We didn't USED to need a rule about how many posts one could make in a day, then someone posted NINETEEN articles in a single day. Not comments, FULL ARTICLES. If you're posting more than say, 10 or so, consider going outside and touching grass. We reserve the right to limit over-posting so a single user does not dominate the front page.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


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Recommendations

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https://addons.mozilla.org/...

  • Consider including the article’s mediabiasfactcheck.com/ link

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