Hexbearian jerking themselves off about how valuable they are to the rest of the fediverse, suggests "performing a coup"
3 years ago by cacheson to c/meanwhileongrad
"You were the chosen one! It was said that you would destroy the fascists, not join them!"
Although, tbf, I think I'd still be somewhat annoyed at Hexbear style discourse even if it was oriented towards a good cause. Much less annoyed, of course, but "I know you are but what am I?", Sea Lioning, Gish Galloping, and images of pigs pooping on their own balls are not great for the tone of any community.
Let's face it, these people are run-of-the mill internet trolls who are working with a politics angle. Their only cause is distruption of online communities for shits and giggles. Treat them like any other troll - block on user level, defederate on instance level.
Bro I had them call me a bigot because I dared to suggest trans people aren't trans when they've finished transitioning. They're just whatever gender they transitioned to. That and, oh god the horror, that trans people in sports is complicated for reasons.
That's it. That makes me a bigot. Literally accepting them, accepting them makes you a bigot because it isn't on their terms.
Delusional authists seem to think the world should bend over backwards for them. Surprise surprise, it doesn't.
One called me an eugenicist because I don't wear masks any more when I go to public places.
They claim we just don't like having opinions challenged. No, I'm okay with new ideas, but when they come bundled in a sandwich of insults and mockery, the ideas lose their appeal. I don't understand why the hexbears don't get that. It's always everyone else's fault that no one wants to talk to them.
these people a literally cultists.
Same as the the MAGAts
Are you seriously suggesting that if we just talk to them we can come to a compromise? Because they're absolutely not interested in compromise, that's why they're like MEGA. They are absolutely categorically not interested in anyone else's point of view, all they want to do is beat you repeatedly over the head with a big stick until you agree with them, or at least say you agree with them.
The world does not need ultra nationalists. We've had them before and they don't make things better.
Both groups can just fuck off.
I'd agree with you, if Hexbears weren't so obnoxious and cultish. First, they will hit you over the head with 20 different links on why the Tiananmen Square massacre was actually a fake, how the Uyghur genocide is fake as well, how China is the bestest democracy to ever have graced the earth and if you dare cite Wikipedia, you're just spewing CIA talking points. They are anti-billionaire only to the extend they can blame the US for. And if you won't play their little game of debunking all the drivel they throw at you, they just start to post their pig shit image. There's a reason they have it hot-linked on their instance: https://www.hexbear.net/PPB (NSFW)
No, it's just that they all use the exact same play book
Oh that's what that image is, lol that's disgusting.
If that ground involves claiming that the Holodomor was the fault of the farmers, then I want nothing to do with it.
This finding common ground is always better than constantly trying to dunk on people ☝️
It's weird how they can't seem to realize they're literally, exactly the same as trumpers. They're just tanky Qanon. It'd be funny if it wasn't so sad.
I'm fairly certain most of them are trumpers. They're far right 4chan trolls roleplaying as what they think leftists sound like (and they're really not very good at it), possibly for laughs, possibly to make leftists sound bad, probably both. And some of them are Chinese and / or Russian shill bots.
Eh, I think you're making it too complicated. The simplest explanation is normally true. They're just brainwashed low intelligence goons forming a groupthink echo chamber. Instead of blaming brown people and "libruls" they blame capitalists, liberals etc.
They’re just brainwashed low intelligence goons forming a groupthink echo chamber.
That's what leftzero said.
They are beyond delusional.
Yup, logically inconsistent, and if you confront them about it they tell you they are just being "le masters of irony".
communism in theory is vastly superior to whatever we have now. But in practice it's entirely inept for the human race. Maybe we should consider some sort of meritocracy that doesn't rely on bottom up or top down extremes. Transparency and equal opportunity should be the core tenants
communism in theory is vastly superior to whatever we have now. But in practice it’s entirely inept for the human race.
I'm assuming that what you are referring to as 'communism' is actually Marxism-Leninism, they''re different things. Yes, state socialism (Marxism) has proven that it can end badly, but it's not the only way to implement socialism, others have proven or are proving they can work.
Maybe we should consider some sort of meritocracy
Real meritocracy doesn't exist, not without real communism first. Each generation inherits a set of inequalities from the previous one, ignoring them to only focus on achievements becomes a tool for the powerful to justify their power (I received a small loan of a million dollar and did fine, that means I deserve living life on easy mode; meanwhile the poor guy that dropped out of school to pay the bills didn't work hard enough to lift himself out of poverty).
Revolutionary Catalonia existed for weeks and really shouldn't be used as an example of proving the success of anything. It simply wasn't around long enough for if to do much.
While the Kurdish groups are interesting they exist within a larger state that is taking on several roles of the state, such as maintaining the larger economy, so that the Kurds do not have to do so. Thus the Kurds aren't proving the efficacy of their system independent of a capitalist system as it is in a capitalist nation-state.
I don't think you have good examples here.
Revolutionary Catalonia existed for weeks
More like 2-3 years. Yes, it's still not much, but not mere weeks either. There were also other anarchist territories at the time and they all worked under socialist principles, none of them caused famines, deportations nor genocides; they don't exist anymore because they got betrayed and hunted down by the soviets, which were authoritarian since day 1.
While the Kurdish groups are interesting they exist within a larger state that is taking on several roles of the state
The Syrian state? During a civil war? Like, what roles?
And is it actually the state taking those roles? At the end of the day, all politicians do is sign papers, the world is shaped by the workers. It's workers that build and run hospitals, railways etc. If workers under the Syrian state can make the electricity run, why would the same workers suddenly not be able to anymore "under" the kurds?
I don’t think you have good examples here.
How about the Zapatistas, then? They're around since the 90s and they're independent from the Mexican state.
Meanwhile in my Lemmy app....
(Blocked by an instance filter)
(Blocked by an instance filter)
(Blocked by an instance filter)
(Blocked by an instance filter)
(Blocked by an instance filter)
(Blocked by an instance filter)
Connect has instance and community blocks.
As suggested, Connect. Excellent filter capabilities. My feed is pretty enjoyable now, at least on my phone. The only thing I'm missing is filtering out comments with specific keywords but that isn't a huge issue. I downvote and occasionally block a user if they just post an emoji or a pun.
I even have a "system":
I only interact with content that I find interesting. Not a huge fan of defederation if it's not pedo paradise or spam bot/troll farm. There are some good tutorials online on how to tie a noose if one of those two are your thing. Everyone has the right to an opinion and I have the right to ignore crazies.
Not easily, no (unless you mean unfiltering a single instance, not temporarily turning off all filtering). The best option for that kind of thing seems to be to use a different app when you don't want to filter stuff.
Connect will block instances or communities. Several instances like .world have defederated hexbear at this point (as everyone should), so that's an option too.
Sync has it but not for comments I believe.
That's the political spectrum ....I used to see it as a line with left on one side and right on the other. After reading and leaving a whole bunch in my own, I now see it as a circle where we all try to basics ourselves and our ideas at the top centre, if we drift too far left or too far right, we'll slide down and eventually meet our political opposite at the bottom where everyone acts the same anyway.
As a leftist, we don't claim these people. Their views are left-coded but inherently antithetical to leftist values. Marxism-Leninism is an attempt (and quite a successful one) to appease revolutionary sentiment by embracing the aesthetics of the left but wrapping it in an authoritarian state. It's similar to how the nazis called themselves socialists to leech off the socialist sentiment in Germany at the time. These dopes like leftist aesthetics but completely miss the mark on any leftist policy.
What you are describing is known as the "horseshoe theory" and is widely rejected by political science.
The actual way to portray such things is a political spectrum, but with 2 or more axes, also known as a "political compass".
I like the political compass as a tool for mapping politics beyond left-right (with more dimensions it's even better, but sparsely populated, which indicates that it is missing some symmetries of politics), but it fails to grasp how politics is not as much a spectrum as it is a tree of ideas that mate with each other and evolve, diverge according to circumstances.
You wouldn't say that there is a spectrum between a shark and a dolphin, but they share a common ancestor and have similarities driven by their environment.
It's this nuance of accumulated history that the political compass can oversimplify as a snapshot for people without the time to waste studying political history.
Well yes, but it was never the goal of the political compass to portray the history of beliefs. It is just a way to visualize the current alignment.
There's plenty of correct ways to criticize them, you don't need to resort to ableist slurs my dude. We can be better than that.
It's very possible to offer constructive criticism without having been offended.
Calm down
Honestly I'm pretty sure the coup part happened on reddit. I feel like I witnessed multiple subs get taken over by tankies.
That's not ironic. They're authoritarians. I very much doubt that they're against forcing people to be collectivists.
They have been doing that. Other threads on lemmy world have the nazis admitting to it.
What is with the overuse of the term Nazi? Nazi means a "national socialist", an ideology that is, among other things, anti-communist.
Wow, this is amazing. Not at all like what happened at reddit...
I appreciate the fuck out of Hexbear. Over the past few years I've seen a massive ideological shift in a bunch of communities I use to enjoy. Like feminist communities shifted from egalitarian/humanist perspectives towards more bigioted attitudes, people stopped caring about confronting their own biases, and instead try to justify them, because "the patriarchy". I've encountered these people in real life. I once got in an argument with another nonbinary with them telling me "You need to understand the world sees you as a white male".
I see people getting called white supremace for calling out racism.
Sorry I know this is a ramble, still processing.
Anyways, now that I see the fingerprints of Marxism I can just call it out.
I think this is a side effect of social media algorithms as a whole. It pushes people into more extreme views of content/ideoligies that they already have, potentially pushing them to a point they wouldn't have chosen.
The thing is you use to see rebuttals, but now you don't. I don't really know, but I remember a massive shift when Trump began raising in popularity Reddit communities started to become a lot more insular. You'd get autobanned from communities if you posted in a subreddit with the wrong political affiliation.
And then just last year I was on my local subreddit, one user was just being blatant racist towards whites, another user posted "What happened to colourblindness", I reported the first comment, the mods locked the second. So I asked what was up, and got told "colourblindness is white supremace rhetoric", and they saw nothing wrong with the anti-white comment.
I think it's not just the content that's being curated, but our userbases.
I align somewhere near communism/socialism/anarchism. They are so fucking stupid though. They will argue that a political class taking all control is good for the working class. The goal of communism is to transfer control to the working class, though there is an argument to be made the methods of getting there require some form of government control first. They don't care that things in China are being consolidated still. They're authoritarian first, not communist.
Can we not assume that every question asked on Lemmy is hostile? I don't see what's wrong with that comment. Besides, I don't think @goat@sh.itjust.works is pro-hexbear anyway.
Because it's irrelevant what country they're from. An argument should stand or fall on its own merits, not on the basis of who makes it. In that sense the question isn't an intellectually serious one. People can sense that even if they don't necessarily articulate it, hence the downvotes.
Because most the people in this thread are just here yo flex hate on anything they consider anti american without actually engaging in actual discussion.
You know, like the discussion that happens on hexbear that is constantly met with 'fuck you tankie'.
Man i wish I could clean my shirt with the ironing of this comment 🤣
I mean, we don't need to spread toxicity on the fediverse by making fun of folks. I thought we left that behind. If hexbear users become a problem, they can be blocked. Otherwise let folks be whatever they want. We don't need to recreate the same shitty subs from reddit that just exist to make fun of people.
Tankies and fascists must never feel welcome, and for the same reasons. Even Chompskyites, monarchists, and ancaps pale in comparison. Tankies and fascists have no interest in being part of a functioning community that isn't run by them.
... though I might suggest making ancaps unwelcome simply to avoid the inevitable age of consent arguments.
Why did you say fascist twice?
I won't normally try to correct people on it, but fascists and tankies aren't quite the same. The latter are vile authoritarians, but fascism is a more specific thing, even if it's still kind of fuzzy and hard to nail down.
Though if you just meant it as a joke, carry on. o7
Paradox of tolerance, my friend. To maintain a tolerant society, you cannot tolerate intolerance.
Or, in other words: Tolerance is a social contract. When others break that social contract, you have the right to respond in kind.
Outright denying genocides and praising Putin's aggression in Ukraine is what I'd call intolerant. I don't care what your pronouns are or how LGBTQ friendly you are, supporting fascism and genocide is not okay and breaks the social contract we have.
As I alluded to in another comment, I'm not necessarily against the dunking itself, I'm against the death cult ideology that they bring with them. If you find that kind of mockery annoying, then this probably isn't a community you want to involve yourself in.
We don't need to recreate the same shitty subs from reddit that just exist to make fun of people.
That's literally a sub that hexbear has. Dunking on libs. That's one of the core tenets of hexbear. (I'm not pro or anti hexbear, but they espouse the literal thing you're defending them for.)
I'm not defending them? I'm just saying we don't need to create a community to make fun of others. I just think if that's all that instance is, block it or ask the instance defederate it.
ask the instance defederate it.
That's in progress. The reason for the recent flurry of activity on this community is that hexbear recently federated with sh.itjust.works, and the users of both instances seem to now be pretty unhappy with that decision.
No, cause they're clearly a problem and I recommended defederating instead. Are you suggesting you prefer you rather be like them? You admit they're a problem but advocate to do the same thing as them. That's a fucked up defense. You are bringing yourself to their level.
Moreover, I'm guessing they must be defederated from a lot of the instances in my network because I rarely ever see posts from them. But I see posts making fun of them constantly. So either they're not a problem and others are or most of them took the nature and less toxic way of dealing with the issue.
If toxicity shows up in my feed, I'm not s fan and this has been showing up constantly.
And to circle back, are we four years old now that your argument is that they're doing it so you can do to too? Jfc, grow the fuck up.
@sh.itjust.works
"Oh, this is calamity! Calamity! Oh no, he's on the floor!"
Documenting hate speech, conspiracy theories, apologia/revisionism, and general tankie behaviour across the fediverse. Memes are welcome!
(caution of biased source)
Basic Rules:
Sh.itjust.works Instance rules apply! If you are from other instances, please be mindful of the rules. — Basically, don't be a dick.
Hate-Speech — You should be familiar with this one already; practically all instances have the same rules on hate speech.
Apologia — (Using the Modern terminology for Apologia) No Defending, Denying, Justifying, Bolstering, or Differentiating authoritarian acts or endeavours, whether it be a Pro-CCP viewpoint, Stalinism, Islamic Terrorism or any variation of Tankie Ideology.
Revisionism — No downplaying or denying atrocities past and present. Calling Tankies shills, foreign/federal agents, or bots also falls under this rule. Extremists exist. They are real. Do not call them shills or fake users, as it handwaves their extremism.
Off-topic Discussion — Do not discuss unrelated topics to the point of derailing the thread. Stay focused on the direct content of the post, rather than engaging in arguments that lack mutual agreement.
Brigading/Trolling — If you're here because this community was linked in another thread, please refrain from maliciously voting, commenting, or manipulating the post in any way. This includes alt accounts. All votes are public, and if you are found to be brigading, you will be banned. Good-faith and honest communication is an exception.
Tankies can explain their views, but may be criticised or challenged for them. Any minor infraction of the rules may result in a warning and possibly a temporary ban.
In most cases, you'll be warned if you're violating the instance and community rules. Continuing poor behaviour after being warned will result in a ban or removal of your comments. Depending on the content, the ban time may vary.
go to feed...
@sh.itjust.works
"Oh, this is calamity! Calamity! Oh no, he's on the floor!"
Documenting hate speech, conspiracy theories, apologia/revisionism, and general tankie behaviour across the fediverse. Memes are welcome!
(caution of biased source)
Basic Rules:
Sh.itjust.works Instance rules apply! If you are from other instances, please be mindful of the rules. — Basically, don't be a dick.
Hate-Speech — You should be familiar with this one already; practically all instances have the same rules on hate speech.
Apologia — (Using the Modern terminology for Apologia) No Defending, Denying, Justifying, Bolstering, or Differentiating authoritarian acts or endeavours, whether it be a Pro-CCP viewpoint, Stalinism, Islamic Terrorism or any variation of Tankie Ideology.
Revisionism — No downplaying or denying atrocities past and present. Calling Tankies shills, foreign/federal agents, or bots also falls under this rule. Extremists exist. They are real. Do not call them shills or fake users, as it handwaves their extremism.
Off-topic Discussion — Do not discuss unrelated topics to the point of derailing the thread. Stay focused on the direct content of the post, rather than engaging in arguments that lack mutual agreement.
Brigading/Trolling — If you're here because this community was linked in another thread, please refrain from maliciously voting, commenting, or manipulating the post in any way. This includes alt accounts. All votes are public, and if you are found to be brigading, you will be banned. Good-faith and honest communication is an exception.
Tankies can explain their views, but may be criticised or challenged for them. Any minor infraction of the rules may result in a warning and possibly a temporary ban.
In most cases, you'll be warned if you're violating the instance and community rules. Continuing poor behaviour after being warned will result in a ban or removal of your comments. Depending on the content, the ban time may vary.
go to feed...
The irony is that if they were merely antifascists that were dunking on racists and transphobes, a lot of people would genuinely appreciate them. The tankie brain-rot ruins that though.
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