Not a socialist

16 days ago by SaltyAmerican to c/latestagecapitalism

fonix232 90 points 16 days ago
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Tyrq 29 points 16 days ago
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BrainInABox 4 points 16 days ago

"genocide is good"

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catsarebadpeople 1 point 15 days ago
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BrainInABox -3 points 15 days ago

Ok. You said it

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lennee 27 points 16 days ago

tiny steps in the right direction no steps back

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K1nsey6 2 points 16 days ago

That's the problem with incrementalism. It only marches to the right.

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jdr 0 points 16 days ago

One tiny one?

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sartalon -4 points 16 days ago
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MrGeneric 17 points 16 days ago

They couldn’t even give up their slaves, give black people rights without blood, you think they’ll allow their power to be taken peacefully?

Do you think we have no blood now? That homeless aren’t dying in the winter, that CEOs aren’t denying 90 percent of claims?

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sartalon -3 points 16 days ago
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Cowbee 4 points 15 days ago

Communists are not the reason capitalism is failing.

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5318008 2 points 14 days ago

Destroying which building? A building that facilitates taking the spoils of imperialism? A building that exploits poverty for the sake of shareholders, resulting in, by some estimates, 200,000 deaths every year? A building that enacts more violence than it would take to deatroy?

Yes, definitely destroy it before it gets built. That's hardly a question.

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K1nsey6 12 points 16 days ago

Something's gotta give. The liberal approach doesn't work. All they do is collude with Republicans.

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SaltyAmerican -13 points 16 days ago

There are no purity tests, there is socialist and then there are right wing fascists, Democrats fall within that category.

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marx 4 points 15 days ago

False dichotomies are stupid

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Avicenna 51 points 16 days ago

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stembolts 40 points 16 days ago
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K1nsey6 14 points 16 days ago

Infighting suggests that Democrats and leftists are the same thing. They're not.

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stembolts -8 points 16 days ago
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K1nsey6 6 points 15 days ago

Wrong ideas that provide protection and cover for fascists should be censored. The main issue is liberals don't care about censorship, they only care about being told no.

Liberals never come into leftist spaces for discussion, they come in demanding we support them, that we've got it all wrong, and we are the reason they are huge piles of steaming shit.

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HasturInYellow 35 points 16 days ago

This comment section:

REMOVED

....what happened here?

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SaltyAmerican 9 points 16 days ago

Probably liberals that cannot read the rules.

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ddplf 2 points 16 days ago
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K1nsey6 3 points 15 days ago

Trash in trash out.

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kepix 0 points 14 days ago

as my father used to say "the kgb do understand the jokes, but they dont like jokes"

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catsarebadpeople -2 points 15 days ago
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Doc_Crankenstein 4 points 14 days ago

You do know OP doesn't have power to delete other people's comments, right?

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Cowbee 3 points 15 days ago

This is a socialist community, not one for welfare capitalism. This isn't about purity testing, it's about adhering to definitions.

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K1nsey6 1 point 15 days ago

What you call purity test the rest of the civilized world call accountability. You support a party of fascists and they need to be held accountable. Oh, and this comment is getting deleted as well as your others since you can't read.

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mycodesucks 25 points 16 days ago
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SaltyAmerican 13 points 16 days ago

There is no infighting because Democrats are not leftists. The fighting that you see is Democrats trying to demand that they are leftists, and not right wing Republicans, like their history shows.

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JigglySackles 3 points 15 days ago

I think the struggle is that while the party and establishment dems that run it are basically republican lite. A lot of people still in the party, who don't fit or agree with the establishment, haven't come, for whatever reason, to the realization that that is what the democratic party has become.

I think for some it's a laziness issue. For others it's not having enough resources to understand. And for some it's probably a hesitancy to no longer ally with a party they have long been a part of. In the US, parties tend to be like factions that people dedicate to instead of a means to a political end.

Also most Americans still think left and liberal are the same thing. So there's that hurdle too.

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SaltyAmerican -2 points 15 days ago

that is what the democratic party has become.

This is who they've always been

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jdr 2 points 16 days ago

Is there any other reason to live?

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Gullible 23 points 16 days ago
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K1nsey6 10 points 16 days ago

There is no divide and conquer because Democrats are not socialists. They're not even left wing.

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Gullible -4 points 16 days ago

I'm not talking about democrats. You're hitting more stray targets than intended ones

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K1nsey6 11 points 16 days ago

And what exactly are you talking about? Leftists are not divided. Liberals that think they are socialist coming into leftist spaces is what's viewed as division.

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Gullible -7 points 16 days ago

I was speaking on socialism in Europe, which you also take exception to!

And don't lie, I've been in more pissing matches with Leninists than I can count.

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Septimaeus 8 points 16 days ago
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K1nsey6 7 points 16 days ago

There is no division because Democrats are not left wing, they are right wing fascists.

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Gullible 5 points 16 days ago

I wouldn't say that it's universal, but there are an enormous number of exceedingly exclusionary people here. People who'd rather be right than advance their goals. Once again, it's far from universal. I met my first few anonymous people who were actually interested in self reflection on lemmy. It's a place that's open to ideas, which is why I hate these posts. They close people down. It's the paradox of tolerance, in reverse

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K1nsey6 1 point 15 days ago

Our goals do not include a coalition with those defending capitalism

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rumimevlevi 2 points 16 days ago

Virtue signaling used to be called principles

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Septimaeus 1 point 13 days ago

My comment had NOTHING whatsoever to do with either Democrats or Liberalism. I criticized Lemmy’s fractured Leftist culture, exemplified by OP in every post of his I’ve seen.

Is this… moderator abuse?

This and my previous comment can always be read at https://infosec.pub/u/Septimaeus and this mod can’t delete that evidence from my profile, because he was banned instance-wide years ago.

screencap of abuse and lies. Proof: original comment that clearly had nothing whatsoever to do with either democrats or liberalism. Comment reads “That is the majority of posting by users like OP. Malicious or not, it’s reliably upvoted by Lemmings. We evidently love churning the division cycles with outrage porn, purity-testing of comrades, victim-blaming of the oppressed, and gatekeeping the “True” Left and praxis orthodoxy. We’ll bury calls for solidarity or teamwork, any form of thought leadership, any call to action, but gladly amplify reactionary cynicism, accelerationist doomerism, and commiserative wallowing. And since every problem is someone else’s fault, solutions are always someone else’s responsibility. Any offered by comrades are bad ideas though, and users like OP leap at the opportunity to explain how they will fail to _applause_. We prefer that hopelessness because it means there’s nothing to be done. Ultimately, divisive posts by users like OP wouldn’t be so popular if he wasn’t representative of the lurking majority: the cowardly edgelords and leftist posers who sow division and defeat among us. Are they working for the fascists? I don’t know. But if they aren’t, they missed their calling.”

Smh

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the_q 5 points 16 days ago

It's not not that.

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4am 0 points 16 days ago
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K1nsey6 6 points 16 days ago

There is no divide because Democrats are not left wing.

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AgentSeven 15 points 16 days ago
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OrteilGenou 15 points 16 days ago

No that's just logic.

Socialist enough would be dismantling the legal framework that allows corporations to exist, and replacing that with something that decentralizes the distribution of wealth so that funnels of greed are a thing of the past.

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hcf 5 points 16 days ago

Or establishing legal frameworks that promote (or require) worker cooperatives/socialist enterprises where shares/decisions are redistributed amongst the workers comprising the enterprise (but not the whole of society).

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Cowbee 6 points 16 days ago

That's petty bourgeois capitalism, not socialism. This isn't about purity or anything, socialism is about the working class owning the means of production and distribution, not creating petty bourgeois cooperatives.

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hcf -1 points 14 days ago

First of all, you mean petite bourgeoisie, which would be like craftsmen, independent store owners, small businesses, or self-employed contractors.

I am referring to the factory workers owning the factory, or social cooperatives. That might be a far cry from what people wish socialism encompassed, but that is not petite bourgeoisie. You won't find me championing the cause of small business tyrants, lordy.

The Emilia-Romagna region of northern Italy comes to mind, where nearly 1/3rd of the GDP comes from worker or social co-ops.

Sorry you don't like cooperatives, but that doesn't grant you the right to misconstrue my intentions based upon a flimsy, hand-wavy reference to Marxist jargon. We get it, you've read all three volumes of Das Kapital.

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mobyduck648 1 point 15 days ago
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K1nsey6 5 points 16 days ago

I'm betting you were silent when Bill Clinton kicked millions off of welfare. When Biden kicked millions of children off SNAP.

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NoneOfUrBusiness 2 points 16 days ago

That's a necessary but not sufficient part of socialism, is what the meme is trying to say.

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BeardededSquidward 10 points 15 days ago

People saying this is purity testing or similar, this is showing a difference between neo-liberal politics and their believers versus actual leftists or socialists. The term "liberal" has been misconstrued to mean left when it certainly is not. I want the USA to stop invading other countries, I want them to still provide aid for countries but preferably not military. Ukraine would be a situation we would provide military aide to so they can repel fascist invaders.

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TheStaffmaster 4 points 15 days ago

that ticked me off so much. If the west as a whole went full bore in assisting Ukraine between Feb of 22' and Oct of 22' that invasion would be in the rear view mirror and russia would have so much egg on its face the Russian people probably would have ousted Putin in a full blown revolt. But here we are. I suppose on the plus side we now know how effective drone warfare is. I wouldn't expect less from the nation that invented the incendiary Pigeon as a viable method of breaking a siege. Always thinking outside the box, those Ukrainians ;)

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nummy 10 points 15 days ago

I'd take those instead of more awful people. And it can also be the first step for someone to achieve class consciousness.

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SaltyAmerican -2 points 15 days ago

Those are the awful people, they believe what they've been told is socialism with no question. These are the people that are politically illiterate

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Honytawk 2 points 14 days ago

No, the evil people are taking all that money and giving it to the stinking rich to empower fascists and do even more imperialism, you impregnated shoe pebble.

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Doc_Crankenstein 1 point 14 days ago

You can be awful without being evil. Politically ignorant/illiterate are awful even if they aren't necessarily evil.

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nummy 0 points 14 days ago

They can be annoying, frustrating, naive and so on. It doesn't mean they won't believe in the same ideas, they're just a bit ignorant. That's why it's important to explain why this line of thinking in this meme is harmful, not to shame them. There's a path to "wokeness", basically, it's not instant.

Not everyone is terminally online, especially if they're working two jobs just to survive. We must not gatekeep socialist ideas, it's one of those things on the left that divides people and drives them away.

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BrainInABox -2 points 14 days ago

you impregnated shoe pebble.

Go back to reddit

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phar 8 points 16 days ago
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MrGeneric 8 points 16 days ago

There is something to say about pushing for just getting the boot off the workers neck. Many become complacent, it also continues to exploit the global south, many lose sight of that

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stembolts 2 points 16 days ago

Hey bro, you got it wrong. You need to censor people who want what you want in a different way. That will make them want to help you achieve your goal.

Does that not make sense to you? Don't think about it too much. If you don't think about it at all, and ban thought from your mind, you can join the mod team here, sign up today!

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chicken 5 points 16 days ago

What would be an example of this?

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SaltyAmerican 17 points 16 days ago

The biggest example is the Nordic model. It's not the least bit socialist. It is 100% capitalist that uses the exploitation of the global south to benefit their citizens. It is also liberals to think things like fire departments, schools and taxation a socialist.

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Squirrelknight 4 points 15 days ago

Then where's an example of "real" socialism to you?

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Cowbee 0 points 15 days ago

In the modern day, the PRC, Vietnam, DPRK, Laos, and Cuba.

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DegradationDenial -4 points 16 days ago

Next you'll tell me Robert Owen is not a socialist, or that reform can not happen with socialism.

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Doc_Crankenstein 3 points 14 days ago

You cannot reform capitalism into socialism. They are fundamentally oppositional. It would require revolutionizing the entirety of our economic and political systems. This is BASIC theory. Please read a fucking book.

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DegradationDenial 1 point 14 days ago

I’m talking about reform of the definition or the method to reach socialism. Like the difference of methods between Rosa Luxemburg, Lenin, Mao, Eduard Bernstein.

I am, currently the quotations of Mao, and to be honest it sounded great until he explained that his definition of democracy was not mine or most people’s in current day.

As a dutch citizen with a parliamentary voting system (not FPTP barbarism) it seems to me deeply egotistical and frightening to read his definition:

  1. The fact that the proletariat revolution prevailed means that the following state body is inherently democratic: this ignores that you need a small minority of well armed people for a revolution compared to a majority vote
  2. That using Marx’s democratic centrism as democracy ignoring the obvious corruptible methods defended by his other notes: of unity through punishment for those against him.
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DegradationDenial -1 points 14 days ago

Plato’s • Philosopher Kings

I’ve tried to explain it to others but like you they swore at me, took my arguments out of context or proportion or used propaganda to negate my point.

Even amongst socialists you will find little proponents for Philosopher Kings.


https://feddit.nl/comment/27815475

Thanks to this eloquent statement you fulfill the definition of Tankie and I’ll be blocking you, any other tankies please block me too.

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SaltyAmerican 1 point 15 days ago

Any actual socialist that's read a single word of theory knows reform is a failure

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4am -1 points 16 days ago
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SaltyAmerican 8 points 16 days ago

Democrats and Republicans are believing the entirely wrong things. So wrong to the point that someone like Trump was a viable candidate.

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HertzDentalBar -4 points 15 days ago

Authoritarian socialism for the win baby

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SaltyAmerican -2 points 15 days ago

Keeping the trash out isn't authoritarianism

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HertzDentalBar -2 points 15 days ago

It's a flavour of if. But I'm not against it, I think people are ignorant enough they need a little kick in the ass from time to time, myself included.

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makeshift0546 -5 points 16 days ago
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latestagecapitalism
latestagecapitalism

@lemmy.world

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A place for for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. That means any support for any liberal capitalist political party (like the Democrats) is strictly prohibited.

A zero-tolerance policy for bigotry of any kind. Failure to respect this will result in a ban.

RULES:

1 Understand the left starts at anti-capitalism.

2 No Trolling

3 No capitalist apologia, anti-socialism, anti-communism, or liberalism, liberalism is in direct conflict with the left. Support for capitalism or for the parties or ideologies that uphold it are not welcome or tolerated.

4 No imperialism, conservatism, reactionism or Zionism, lessor evil rhetoric. Dismissing 3rd party votes or 'wasted votes on 3rd party' is lessor evil rhetoric.

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