Apple is ordered to face Apple Pay antitrust lawsuit
3 years ago by Lee Duna to c/technology
I mostly agree, but then I think about how I have a Samsung phone but can still use Google Wallet instead of Samsung Pay because it's an open ecosystem. They both push their own products, but the end user is ultimately able to use whatever product they want. This is clearly not the case for Apple, which is what I'm guessing the case is about.
It has to be this. As a non apple device user, I can use ANY pay system EXCEPT Apple pay. You must own an apple device to use it. There might be some roundabout way on PC with iTunes, but even if there is, it's unaccessible on a phone.
Why not block? Apple makes the hardware and the os. They should have control over the things they make.
Imagine picking a gas station based on your car model...
I’m going to introduce you to Tesla.
More than a century ago we decided that that kind of monopolistic behaviour is bad for the economy and society in general, so we made laws to ban it. You're welcome to lobby your politicians to dismantle anti-trust laws. You just won't get much support. Monopolies are quite terrible.
And you might have an argument if there weren’t a couple dozen different phone manufacturers.
Nobody is forced to buy an iPhone and participate in the Apple ecosystem. They’re far from the only option.
Look up anti competitive behavior and previous antitrust lawsuits to see how bad that becomes.
I’m sorry, no. I say this as someone who has been full on in the Apple ecosystem for decades. Other than my Linux gaming computer and my Garmin watch, pretty much all my personal devices are made by Apple.
I paid money for that NFC device in my iPhone. I should own it, not Apple. In the same vein, I paid money to have iOS running on the hardware I’m supposed to own. I should be able to decide what I want to run on it.
Unfortunately, at the moment I personally find all the alternatives much worse, so I begrudgingly accept those limitations. That doesn’t mean I like them, it doesn’t make them right, and it certainly doesn’t excuse Apple’s anti-consumer behaviour on those particular matters.
And I own the phone and I should be able to do what I want with it. Why does the company providing a product get more rights to that product than the individually physically owning it. Bs like that, like not supporting proper sideloading, is why I moved away from apple.
Then you made the right choice for you.
Apple decided to implement in their OS one wallet for payments, one consistent set of user experience with security and privacy, open to pretty much any payment card. If you want something else, use something else.
That argument only works if they let you use the phone for free. Otherwise by taking your money for it they're giving you the right to do what you want with it.
Android may push Google pay, but you can still use other options. Samsung pay, some banks have their own contactless payment apps. You have a choice, even if you are nudged in one direction.
On iOS there is no choice. You use apple pay or you use nothing.
If we're following your argument, the logical conclusion would be fuck all of them. So there's no point in complaining when that's 1/3.
The head of the FTC gets a lot of flak from the elite enforcing antitrust laws. But they do get them eventually. They JUST started the Amazon antitrust filing and Google got hit with a suit over their Ads business.
This is the best summary I could come up with:
Sept 27 (Reuters) - Apple (AAPL.O) was ordered on Wednesday to face a private antitrust lawsuit by payment card issuers accusing the company of thwarting competition for its Apple Pay mobile wallet.
U.S. District Judge Jeffrey White said the plaintiffs could try to prove that Apple violated the federal Sherman antitrust law by enforcing a 100% monopoly over the domestic market for tap-and-pay wallets for iPhones, iPads and Apple Watches.
Apple, based in Cupertino, California, did not immediately respond to requests for comment.
"There are billions at stake so getting by the motion (to dismiss) largely intact was huge for the class."
They said Apple "coerces" people who use its smartphones, tablets and smart watches into using its own wallet for tap-and-pay transactions, unlike makers of Android-based devices that let people choose wallets such as Google Pay and Samsung Pay.
European Union antitrust regulators accused Apple in May 2022 of abusing its dominance in iOS devices and mobile wallets.
The original article contains 355 words, the summary contains 159 words. Saved 55%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!
A well-deserved honor.
~I thought there were third-party payment systems on the iPhone already (including ones using NFC)?
And even the convenience advantage Apple Pay enjoys should be gone on the 15 Pro at least as you can map your third-party payment app to the action button.~
EDIT: I stand corrected, see replies.
Sadly not. Apple explicitly prevents payment apps from using the NFC. It’s blatantly anti-competitive and the DMA will soon open this up in the EU.
Nevermind then. I could've sworn I read somewhere that a bank on my country had their own payment system available on the iPhone.
As blatantly anti-competitive as it may be, I don’t want to be in a position where, if I want to pay for something with my phone, I’m forced to use whatever shitty application my bank decides to implement (I’ve had banking applications just decide to stop working for a few days, for no apparent reason; there are banks that have countless applications, each doing something slightly different, with complex, oftentimes downright hostile authentication methods, involving combinations of these apps)
I like the fact that, regardless of card I use, they’re all exposed through the same simple Wallet application, that always works.
The big difference in such a situation is that you have the freedom to choose a different bank if their payment app is bad. You do not currently have the freedom to choose a different payment app on your iPhone. This is the fundamental issue the EU and US are addressing.
For NFC, no one really does that even on Android even though NFC is available for use. Instead, in some countries they use QR-code payments to bypass the NFC limitations that Apple imposed.
There are choices. You don’t like Apple Pay, get an Android phone.
Apple is manufacturing the phones and creating the ecosystem associated to the phone.
Because they manufacture the whole thing, they may get away with it as a hardware feature, which they protect for security and privacy reasons, which is their sales pitch to their customers.
Apple doesn’t sell its OS to other manufacturers.
Google does. And because they do that, they have to let other manufacturers have access to the OS features that manage payments through .
Android phones have been dinged with vulnerabilities through NFC technology.
Microsoft has been dinged with anti-Trust losses because they forced their features on other devices and quenched other manufacturers to do what they wanted. Apple doesn’t deal with other manufacturers. Apple doesn’t force customers to only do Apple Pay for transactions. Sure, it’s a feature they offer, but you can use Venmo, PayPal, Zelle, etc. with your phone. Even Google Pay. Just not with the phone’s hardware. They don’t even force you to use their card to pay.
In fact, Google and Samsung could use the payment system from Apple, if they create a bank and a card. But no, they can’t design software that could create vulnerabilities to Apple devices...and if that’s Apple’s competitive advantage, why should they give it away?
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I’m not really sure that’s a fair argument. Android generally pushes Google Play, and Samsung devices push Samsung pay. Sure, Android has more choices, but it’s still device manufacturers pushing their own products.
Of course Apple should allow competition within their ecosystem, but Samsung and Google are basically doing the exact same thing.
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