Lawsuit Challenging 2024 Election Results Moves Forward After Kamala Harris Received Zero Votes in a New York County
a year ago by kinther to c/politics
Trump said months before the election that he's got it covered and he isn't worried about it. Why would that be? He told us what he was doing at the time, his people were rigging it.
I also strongly believe in their use of projecting as a preemptive defensive strategy.
They say "you cheated you cheated you cheated!" so we reply "you're nuts there's no evidence, it's all a conspiracy theory" so then they can cheat later on and turn it around on you when you go to investigate. "Oh now it's true because you lost? Yeah yeah yeah..."
They're always playing psychological warfare with the population... :(
They already believe it's happening to them which is why they refuse to listen to any source of information that isn't from their preferred brand.
There are plenty of intelligent MAGA that just have an innate bias that they want to have confimed so they allow themselves to be convinced by mis/disinformation. To admit you were wrong, or to accept that you misunderstood actually creates a "pain" type response that people are very adverse to, there are also the types that have so entrenched themselves in their political beliefs that it becomes their identity. This form of physiological warfare I mentioned is just one way of allowing these people to maintain their identity and to give them a "valid" defense against inconvenient information.
Over time a person can be chipped away at, but if you always give them an answer then they never have to suffer the thought that they were ever wrong about anything so they can remain on "your side."
And even:
Yes, Trump said Musk knows vote-counting computers 'better than anybody'
He knows those computers better than anybody. All those computers. Those vote-counting computers. And we ended up winning Pennsylvania like in a landslide.
— trump, on stage at a victory rally in Washington, D.C., on Jan. 19, 2025
The idiot can’t keep his mouth shut and basically blabbed exactly what they were doing, yet nobody really listened.
It will never cease to astound me.
A strongmen is elected for seeming strong. Of course he will say beforehand that he is certain that he will win. Saying anything else would harm is brand and make less people vote for him. Trump claiming to be successful at anything and everything also isn't something new for him. He did that his entire (adult) life.
This is evidence for Trump being a narcissist and liar, but with the amount of lies, delusional and nonsensical claims he makes, this can be hardly taken as evidence for election fraud.
Hijacking the top comment to mention (as posted in more detail below) that this actually has a very logical explanation. In short, Biden also got 0 votes in some precincts, which was a total flip from 2016 where Clinton won by large margins. The difference? The community is 100% Hasidic, and community leaders met with Clinton during her Senate race while Bill was president. During this time, there were community members being indicted for a fraudulent Hasidic school. The community voted for Clinton for Senate, and shortly after Bill commuted the sentences of these community members. I.e., very possibly a quid pro quo. So that community in particular supports Clinton for this very specific reason, when Trump was still a relatively unknown quantity, and then flips to support Trump for his very aggressive support of Israel during his first term. I despise Trump, and would love him locked up, but these are cherry picked numbers that prove nothing.
I do believe people were calling me alarmist for noticing strange patterns.
Like winning all 7 swing states? Your fucking kidding me right?
Considering how much of a strangle the right has over most media, I didn't consider it surprising. I wouldn't be surprised if it was rigged though.
Also not surprising that investigations weren’t pushed harder after election and before new administration. Biden and Garland should’ve put throttle down on a five-alarm-fire investigation into election. Did they? No. Surprised? Not at all.
Transitions shouldn’t necessarily be smooth if an election was potentially fraudulent — peaceful, yes.
Don't EVER mention that piece of shit quisling coward Merrick Garland without also cursing him ever again.
Wild that that dude was almost a SCOTUS justice.
Biden and Garland should’ve put throttle down on a five-alarm-fire investigation into election.
For that matter, Obama should have conducted an investigation into the 2016 election when he still had the power to do so.
Other irregularities are down ballot Dwmocrat votes. That somehow selected trump he presidents. Such a statistically improbable result
Also from a technical and logistics perspective, Russia already hacked into a variety of polling stations over the last few years and did seemingly nothing but gather information and plan. Technically this isn't hard or even expensive.
So wait a minute here guys, you're telling me that the man who was convicted by a unanimous jury of fraud (cheating) in the 2016 election, the same guy who called the governors of various states and asked them to 'find him some votes' in 2020, did not run a clean honest campaign in 2024???
Get the EFF out of here!!
Nah it's liberal propaganda. Anyways let's storm the capital
You forgot the part where he said he didn't need your votes because he already won...
So I am very much a numbers and data guy. If there are anomalies, I am very happy to acknowledge them. I am also disgusted by Trump and how he is destroying the country, and voted for Kamala in 2024.
With those caveats out of the way, this whole article and lawsuit is cherry picked bullshit. The precincts in question (yes precincts, not counties as the article states), were extremely red in 2020 as well. Some precincts had 0 votes for Biden. Yet these were not questioned back then. Why? Because Biden won the larger election, so who cares? Why are these alleged anomalies not relevant in 2020, but suddenly relevant now? Bare in mind, these were precincts that went strongly for Clinton in 2016, and did a full reversal in 2020.
What was the difference between the two election cycles exactly? The village is 100% Hasidic. Clinton was viewed as pro Israel, and Biden as anti-israel. That is the explanation. This lawsuit will be dismissed, I am certain of it. As much as I would love to see Trump arrested and thrown in jail for something like this, the evidence is not there to support it.
You can check these numbers out yourself by checking the New York times detailed election map for each election year and searching for Ramapo, NY.
EDIT: Actually, upon further research, the shift from Clinton to Trump is much more interesting than I thought. Apparently she met with community leaders in her Senate race, during the same time her husband was president. Some community members at that time were involved in a criminal scandal involving a fraudulent Hasidic school at that time. She was overwhelmingly voted for by this town. Shortly after, her husband commuted these individuals sentences. So clearly the community remembered this. The town is called new square, you can read about the alleged quid pro quo scandal on Wikipedia.
Biden is anti-Israel?
I’ve heard that Biden is a Zionist though so hoe could those both be true?
To hardline zionists, any mention of acknowledgement of the Palestinian people is anti-israel. He is definitely supportive of Israel overall, but Trump was more supportive overall, and won the hasidic vote by an overwhelming majority.
Biden, literally: I am a Zionist
Why shouldn’t Zionism be capitalized?
Bare in mind
Bone apple tea!
Don't kink shame those who yum on Nude Dark Brandon.
Yeah, I think this article is way too far into the weeds. A lot of the comments in this thread are starting to sound a little too much like the right wing conspiracies we saw coming out of the 2020 election. And I get it, we're all looking for ways to prevent this from happening again.
I don't think there was any fraud--bar the usual voter suppression and sleazy tactics the Republicans engage in. Voter turnout went way down for the 2024 election compared to 2020. Had there been wide scale vote tampering, I doubt they would've let the total number of votes for Trump go down. Besides, the 2020 post-election bullshit lawsuits showed that our voting system is relatively secure and it's quite difficult to fabricate votes. The unfortunate reality is that Trump voters really are just that dogmatic and close minded to keep voting for him
When one side has a strangle hold on mainstream media they can make you believe something isn't credible just by not covering it.
There's a reason the right focused on owning most all news media.
This is why manual hand counted votes still happen to this day in Canada and Australia. They both faced the same MAGA threat and the lib won.
Yes it takes longer. And sometimes results will take weeks to resolve but at least they don’t end up in a situation like this where the entire system is so corrupt 4 months later it’s near impossible to fix it.
They both faced the same MAGA threat and the lib won.
Largely thanks to the local public backlash to Trump tariffs. If Kamala had prevailed in November, both countries would likely have MAGA governments today.
Yeah, it's weird to be an American and hope the silver lining of trump is that the rest of the world keeps making better choices in response to how bad this is.
Part of the Trump brand is "Fuck you, I've got mine" which isn't condusive to international coalitions.
Hell, just look at the Ukraine/Russia conflict. As soon as Trump got Zelensky to sign a bunch of Western Ukrainian real estate over to his cronies, he unleashed a large traunch of weapons to fuck over Putin. As soon as he got another Perfect Phone Call from Xi, and secured some unspecified promise, the Chinese tariffs evaporated.
My man stands for nothing that won't fit into his pocket.
We can’t say that. We don’t know what would’ve happened in Canada if Trump lost.
If Trump lost:
- Trudeau might not have resigned
- if he did, Carney might not have became liberal leader
- The election probably wouldn’t have even happened yet, and the campaign likely would’ve been longer when it was.
- Every party would have run very different campaigns since the top issues wouldn’t have been US relations
A lot of things could’ve been different, but most notably:
- PP might not have run a Trump-esk populist attack campaign.
For all we know PP wouldn’t be seen as “the same MAGA threat”
It doesn't take longer. France announces the preliminary results of an election 2 hours after the polling places close.
Note to mention that not only are they harder to scale attacks against, manual vote counts are easier to trust, As anyone can understand the process and how it ensured that their vote counted.
No matter how well they are protected it's hard to explain to the average person how a computer ensures their vote was counted correctly.
"Accuse your enemy of what you intend to do"
Not actually a quite from Goebbels or Marx, but the Republican guiding principle nonetheless.
Accuse your enemy of what you intend to do
It's ironic that Hitler's "Night of the Long Knives" (when the Nazis arrested and eventually murdered numerous brownshirts and their leader, Ernst Roehm) acquired that name because Hitler himself used the expression in a speech that he gave immediately after the event. In the speech, he accused Roehm of having been planning a "NIght of the Long Knives" himself, directed at Hitler and the other Nazi leaders. Quite unintentionally, the phrase came to describe Hitler's actions.
Probably same reason they just gave up in Gore v Bush.
Gore then conceded without continuing to fight, to help the county heal. Because actual fighting to win would be bad
Yes, but then he un-conceded. How do you think it got to the Supreme Court unless he fought?
He brought it to the Florida circuit court, and when he lost he appealed to the Florida Supreme Court, who ruled in his favor. Then Bush appealed to the US Supreme Court.
The problem was a coordinated effort to steal the election by the bitch queen Katherine Harris, Florida Secretary of State and Bush's Florida campaign co-chair, a fake riot by Republican operatives to disrupt a recount, and a collaborating Supreme Court. It was all tied up nicely in a bow and there wasn't much Gore could have done, although he should have requested a statewide recount right from the start instead of just cherry picking solidly Democratic-leaning counties like Miami-Dade.
Because they didn't want to be perceived as doing the same thing as the Republicans after the 2020 election. After complaining about the Republicans not having a "peaceful transfer of power," Dems thought it was important to demonstrate how that works, and be smug about it.
Unfortunately, this was precisely the wrong election to make that point, since this election truly was rat fucked by MAGA.
I've thought about that. But that seems like a terrible strategy, because it lets the Republicans do anything. The Republicans do a bad thing, or accuse you of doing a bad thing, and now you're incapable of responding to it?
Yes, it's a terrible strategy, but it's the easiest one to default to if you are a cowardly spineless weenie Democrat who is afraid to confront serious treason and corruption, like Chuck Schumer. Traditional Dems are satisfied with losing, as long as they can feel smug about being morally superior while doing it, even if it means watching the Reps systematically dismantle America on behalf of the Russians.
We need elected representatives at every level who aren't afraid to go to battle to defend our country from treasonous criminals and Sociopathic Oligarchs.
basically sums up Biden's whole presidency
Others clearly have their pitch forks ready to go but the real reason here is because they won NY. I'd be shocked if any presidential candidate in the history of the US demanded a recount in a state they won.
Is 0 votes suspicious? Absolutely. Is the recount process the right way to uncover something happening at a scale to compromise an entire district's election process? Probably not.
According to Balletpedia, it's unclear who in NY even pays for a voluntary recount (NY has mandatory recounts in close elections).
However suspicious this district is, it's not justification for a recount in another district in a completely different state.
If there is interference at a meaningful scale, it's not going to be uncovered by volunteers working without sleep to deliver election results as quickly as humanly possible. The wheels of justice turn far top slowly.
A lawsuit is a good first step.
lol, democrafts are left??
OK, next question: Let's say we do a 'recount' at this hour, assuming the evidence isn't already lost, what then?
Think he's going to go, ohh my bad?
Think he's going to leave willingly?
Think the court case will even be appropriately handled once it goes to the SCOTUS.
Think the SCOTUS will even hear it?
How is it 100 days later, we just now hear about this?
I think the best outcome would be that it might uncover deliberate malfeasance that might prompt some folks in congress to do what is needed. I wouldn't be optimistic though.
Slightly more likely is that such discovery would drive the public towards a congressional swing away from his enablers at the next congressional election next year, assuming we have it. I'm moderately more optimistic on that, apparently such a swing is already forming, but to what extent isn't clear.
We can't undo the election results, the congressional count done on jan 6 is definitive.
Then it'd be time to put those 2A to use.
That's it, the last box in this lineup:
Ballot -> Soap -> Jury -> Ammo
So if it comes to it y'all are going to have to be willing to use it, unless you'd rather live under a King.
Best case scenarios aren't really on the table. Doesn't mean you stop fighting.
I can see how it looks like I'm saying that I'm not advocating that at all. I just want to make sure that people understand this isn't a direct path to change.
Even a direct admission will not change anyone's mind. You are at best removing a couple of easy outs** for them to lie and say that's not how it is. In the end they're just going to lie and say that it's not real.
It'll be satisfying. It might make some already engaged people a little more engaged, But it isn't **in itself going to drive the needle we're going to need more.
All correct
It's...not 100 days later. Its about 190 days later.
Last time he had to go the Capitol was stormed by terrorists.
Even if this is true, I don’t think they’re going to find the number of votes to change any outcome. Didn’t Trump win by like 3 million votes? Maybe this could have flipped an electoral college vote, but would that have even mattered?
It's a significant assumption that this was an isolated incident.
Even if it's not isolated, how do you move forward after this unless someone involved confesses and gives up other areas involved? Maybe they weren't dumb enough to be this obvious in other spots.
Ideally, you start demanding recounts But I can't imagine that votes are properly taken care of after the fact especially in this case.
But then if we find mass wrongdoing in counts, now it's a court thing, It goes to SCOTUS. Are they going to side with him? Frankly, there's no way. It's going to be authoritarian dictatorship or coup I don't think there's any other viable directions this could go.
Kamala carried New York either way, it absolutely would not change anything in the EC
e: unless it led to the uncovering of widespread fraud in key swing states, but even then they wouldn't do shit
To paraphrase Bush v Gore over negative votes in Florida after the SC sent the case to a lower court and it was appealed back to them
it’s been so long since the election that it would be unfair to change the outcome now
What did they say?
I dont like coward, liars and people entrusted with the protection of me and mine do nothing with the trust except squander it so his crackhead son can get a pardon and the kids for cash judge too. I calls them as I sees them, and its hard to argue with my stance with the direct result of his failures as pres are contributing to an active genocide and the destruction of the american democracy and human rights, what is wrong with you is the question
You are the problem with America right now. You’re out of your mind about things you clearly don’t understand. We’ve entered idiocracy and you’re just busy being a screeching parrot eh?
Why don’t you go search your soul and try to find it
no, but it seems that way to biden when he was in charge. How many pictures of burned babies did i see in gaza, while he was there from our missiles? how many americans are suffering now because of his lack of protecting the country
Gaza is doomed. And far from my mind right now. We've got actual Nazis running the US which we have to deal with because nobody else is going to do it for us.
I dont have a soul, but i do feel consolation that if the heaven biden believes in exists, he aint getting in
The heaven Biden believes in:
"Forgive me father for I have sinned, I drone striked an entire region in the middle east to massive amounts of collateral damage and sent billions of dollars in weapons to Israel to be used against Palestinians."
"Say 3 Hail Marys and one Our Father and you are forgiven."
so we just remove things if they are upsetting? thats even worse than reddit
I always had a feeling that the election was a bit too quickly decided. I’ve said before that in the coming months and years after the 2024 election we would find out something fishy was happening.
That’s honestly what got me too. Like it took a week for them to get all of the results from 2020, and sure, that could’ve been all the mail in ballots, but then you have Rogan saying elongated muskrat had called the election the night OF voting?
I don’t know man. I’ve seen a few elections now and don’t remember that happening.
Agreed it’s very fishy I don’t wanna sound like a tin foil hat conspiracy theorist but if it quacks like a duck then it’s a duck.
If you have a few hours to kill, this podcast had the guy from election truth alliance on. It is the most tolerable of the few podcasts he's appeared on because this guy is data heavy, and quite frankly it can be boring with how much he talks about data and graphs, but the data is there. They are very data driven. Part 2 has most of the data, but essentially votes went way up for Republicans as time went on. Statistically speaking, there should be a similar distribution of votes throughout, but what we see is any time Kamala gets close, a flood of red votes come in. The theory is a vote switching algorithm. Imo Elon saying that without him the Dems get the presidency and the house is not hyperbole. I'm pretty sure they were flipping votes and/ or using data from the super PAC $100 giveaway to file fake votes. There are a bunch of submitted ballots that were down ballot dem, but president and house / Senate (the ones that mattered the most) went to Republicans. The only way to find out is to do audits. And even if (and imo when) we do find out it was stolen, I don't think we have any recourse to remove him, but it would be nice to know that we didn't choose this, and the states can beef up their election security and politicians can stop being so spineless thinking that he's so popular and they are powerless.
The guy was dancing around like a crazy person to Ave Maria at his last rally and yelling about people eating cats and dogs on the debate. There's no way anyone saw that and wanted that running the country save the maybe 8% of the population that are Trump Simps.
His rallies were empty and Harris had the momentum with a packed house everywhere she went. She mopped the floor with him in the debate. The fact that she accepted the results and didn't push for a single recount was asinine imo. With Trump, everything is projection. There's evidence they tried to steal '20 and we're just overwhelmed by the sheer volume of people who voted by mail to oust him. Vote by mail is typically hand counted and harder to alter.
The guy was dancing around like a crazy person to Ave Maria at his last rally and yelling about people eating cats and dogs on the debate. There’s no way anyone saw that and wanted that running the country save the maybe 8% of the population that are Trump Simps.
You overestimate this country.
I will definitely watch this I love Titus.
I'm tired of going high when they go low.
If the new standard is for Republicans to cast doubt on the legitimacy of every election, except for the ones they win, then we should, at the very least, be scrutinizing every single aspect of the election. Refuse to concede, demand recounts, hand tally the electronic ballots, search up and down and under every rock for evidence that the other side is guilty of some foul play.
Because if they had done that in the first place, they might have uncovered shit like this before it was too late to stop the wrong candidate from getting inaugurated. If they had bothered to put up a fight instead of maintaining decorum that the Republicans never bother to show, maybe they would have discovered what many of us already suspected - that Elon Musk somehow tampered with the voting machines to swing the election in Donald Trump's favor in key swing states. They practically admitted as much on stage, and nobody batted an eye at it.
I don't expect to ever live to see another fair election for the rest of my life.
100%!
It doesn't change anything in New York....... And ... In before the flood of other like cases.
Yep, if the machines were tampered with in NY, a relatively liberal bastion, what the fuck does that mean for the swing states?
I'm very much against conspiracy theories, especially concerning our elections which are administered by many many independent entities. I was very concerned as I watched electronic voting machines - especially without paper trails - become more and more popular over the past 30 years. Even more as the industry consolidated and it came down to a handful of private, for-profit manufacturers.
The thing I've read about that is keeping the door of conspiracy open in my mind is the "drop off" rate, which has to do with the number of "President only" ballots, where only the President is chosen, and no down ballot votes are cast.
Apparently Trump's ballots have an unusually high - like statistically unlikely - drop off. And it's either only in or mostly in/more pronounced in swing states.
Even Chris Titus picked it up (3 hrs total, sorry)
https://youtu.be/UgIay64Obcs - Part 1 https://youtu.be/t-yr-Mgkhm0 - Part 2
So on one hand: Harris won NY State by a 10% margin.
On the other hand: if vote machines were tampered with then it likely doesn't stop there.
Yeah, this isn’t really about that one specific district. It’s about all the other districts that were also likely tampered with.
Trump didn't even try to get elected. Total fuck it all pill during his running like he knew he was going to win, then he wins by a huge margin electorally and the popular vote. It was surreal.
If only there was a give movement of Democrat voters telling you loudly WE WON'T VOTE FOR HARRIS...
You guys usually love to blame us for Trump, even though we promised you he would win if you didn't give us an electable candidate, but hey if you now want to change stories again to follow whatever dem narrative is being spun today, then yeah her winning NY so bigly is obviously evidence of a stolen election...
Or she wasn't electable. No no no, it's everyone else's fault.
yup, they kicked out Hogg because of the threat to their lifelong tenures and disrupt their ability to put their thumbs on the scale for the most disappointing republican lite candidates the isreali money wants the dnc to run
Sometimes you have to just suck it up and act/vote to reduce harm. That's called reality. It's like taking chemo if you have a fatal cancer. Chemo SUCKS and you might die of cancer anyway, but if you don't go through it, you will certainly die.
Who was an electable candidate in 2024?
really are some full kool aid dems or paid posters here, you would think biden failing every campaign promise, and protecting trump from prosecution would cause him a little more scorn. Trump was a known quantity, Joe was who was elected to deal with that and he absolutely dropped the ball about as hard as any other person in that office could have. Like i cant think of a way he could have sabotaged his party even if he wanted to intentionally do it rather than as an abject failure of a man
our election was, literally, stolen. Trump and his fascists have spent years calling his loss to Biden “stolen” which ultimately harmed any real attempts at calling out future election results. many statisticians are sounding the alarm bells—something is wrong. the data doesn’t lie and the voting heavily implies manipulation. there is a group investigating our election results and making their findings public. they are very concerned with what they are uncovering.
Biden also received 0 votes in 2020 in these same precincts. See my comment for more details on the explanation. I do not know about the other data, but this one is a nothing burger, unfortunately.
Oops forgot to make the lie a little more believable.
After HitlerPig's 2025 State of the Union speech, new Democratic senator Elissa Slotkin gave the Democratic response, and tried to sell the idea that millions of people in her state voted for her for Senator, but Trump for president.
This past weekend, Amy Klobuchar tried to sell that same fantasy on Meet The Press - that millions in her state voted for her, but also voted for HitlerPig.
I'm sure there are a few people who split their vote, but they have to be as rare as white squirrels. There are supposed to be millions of them, so many that HitlerPig even won EVERY battleground state (an exceptionally unlikely outcome), but I've never heard one actual voter claim they voted a straight Democratic ticket, except HitlerPig for president. It sounds ridiculous when you actually say it.
For the uninitiated: The Alt-Right Playbook's "You Go High, We Go Low"
"Treat the situation like it's fair... because that's what they should have done when it actually was"
There are supposed to be millions of them, so many that HitlerPig even won EVERY battleground state (an exceptionally unlikely outcome), but I’ve never heard one actual voter claim they voted a straight Democratic ticket, except HitlerPig for president.
If you look at the actual vote counts
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/...
Trump | 2,816,636
Harris | 2,736,533
Slotkin | 2,712,686
Rogers | 2,693,680
Harris and Slotkin net out almost perfectly. Trump outran Rogers by over 3% of the vote, which suggests people were showing up to support Mr Cheeto and then leaving the rest of the ballot blank.
That is... not unbelievable. The Trump Cult is strong, while the GOP as a party lags Trump's personality cult substantially.
Polling gets even worse in other Midwestern states, with Harris outright underwater to her down ballot Dems. But there's nobody in the GOP Trump doesn't outpace. The idea that people are voting Trump + Dem is far less likely than voting Trump + Nobody.
Citing the vote counts to prove the point that the election was "fair & square" is like using the Bible to prove that God is real. Of course they prove HitlerPig won, they're rigged! We're supposed to believe he won EVERY swing state? No Republican has won the popular vote since 1988, but we're supposed to believe the least popular Republican president in decades, one who actually LOST his reelection by a wide margin, is the guy to break that streak? Ridiculous.
What makes more sense to me, and is supported by the evidence and personal statements by the players themselves, is that they rigged the election, especially in the swing states, assisted by the richest man in the world (and his army of some of the best tech experts in the world), and Putin, who we know has been actively pursuing cyber-espionage for years.
When will people internalize that the two biggest FOREIGN Sociopathic Oligarchs, one with a government superpower at his disposal, another with the largest fortune on the planet, neither with any loyalty or patriotism toward America, have partnered up with the most prolific traitor in American history, to exploit our country in every way possible? None of them care about history or legacy or reputation, they see America as a rich, fat, lazy target, ripe for exploitation and looting.
The case the election is rigged is also based on citing the purportedly fraudulent election results.
Republicans won the popular vote in 2024.
The swing state results are not independent variables. They usually swing together.
Is it possible the election was rigged? Sure. But the evidence so far is pretty weak.
I mean, I'm going to remain skeptical of widespread fraud until proven otherwise. The thing that people keep forgetting is that almost all states have some random spot checks built into their vote-counting process. Just as a matter of regular course, they'll randomly select a certain number of ballots and compare the hand-counted and machine-counted results.
Also, fuck Trump, but I don't really see anything odd about the idea that far more people would vote for Trump than a Republican Senate candidate. Trump's whole shtick is getting low-propensity politically disengaged people to vote for him. And look at how low Congress's approval ratings are. A fair number of people coming out just to vote for Trump is not unreasonable.
I will point out that this cannot change the result of the presidential election, since Trump didn't win the state in question anyway.
It might open an investigation into other places.
Like in Pennsylvania, perhaps, where he all but admitted to fucking with the voting machines.
Almost like it actually happened and there was no evidence of fraud
It depends on who did the cheating and how prolific it is in other states and counties.
The point is that it all needs to be looked at and reverified
I will point out that if they did it in a state they weren't going to win and that would be too suspicious for them to actually win in the first place, why wouldn't they replicate it in a state they actually needed and on which his election actually hinged? Just means New York was a control/test case
Frankly after election there are two things that bugged me in California. There was a proposition that removed mandatory work requirement for inmates comparing it to a modern day slavery. There was no one who was willing to endorse vote against it (I suppose due to optics) yet the proposition failed.
When he visited CA after fires were already put down and made that spectacle with water dam, he also mentioned that he had a good feeling about next election.
I have a feeling that maybe CA voting is also compromised and this was a test for California, as trump winning here would be extremely suspicious, but no one will care about this proposition.
That one isn't suspicious to me. US public opinion has always had very little regard for anyone who's incarcerated. Hence, once the system gets ahold of you, you're fucked whether you're guilty or not (unless you're wealthy).
There should be penalties for a lot of things that are and have been happening.
This stuff has been going on for a loooong time:
Interview with Stephen Spoonamore on of the electronic voting issues that have been raised for a while now:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRW3Bh8HQic
if you want to jump right to his explanation/comparison to his work with securing credit card transactions against "man in the middle" attacks:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=BRW3Bh8HQic#t=873
The filing also includes the revealing deposition of the late Michael Connell. Connell served as the IT guru for the Bush family and Karl Rove. Connell ran the private IT firm GovTech that created the controversial system that transferred Ohio's vote count late on election night 2004 to a partisan Republican server site in Chattanooga, Tennessee owned by SmarTech. That is when the vote shift happened, not predicted by the exit polls, that led to Bush's unexpected victory. Connell died a month and a half after giving this deposition in a suspicious small plane crash.
Additionally, the filing contains the contract signed between then-Ohio Secretary of State J. Kenneth Blackwell and Connell's company, GovTech Solutions. Also included that contract a graphic architectural map of the Secretary of State's election night server layout system.
Cliff Arnebeck, lead attorney in the King Lincoln case, exchanged emails with IT security expert Stephen Spoonamore. Arnebeck asked Spoonamore whether or not SmarTech had the capability to "input data" and thus alter the results of Ohio's 2004 election. Spoonamore responded: "Yes. They would have had data input capacities. The system might have been set up to log which source generated the data but probably did not."
Spoonamore explained that "they [SmarTech] have full access and could change things when and if they want."
Arnebeck specifically asked "Could this be done using whatever bypass techniques Connell developed for the web hosting function." Spoonamore replied "Yes."
Breakdown of why Electronic voting in general is incredibly insecure:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3_0x6oaDmI
Documentary going into Clint Curtis's story:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhBtfiRKaVY
(the guy from this video):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JEzY2tnwExs
Fractional Voting:
http://blackboxvoting.org/fraction-magic-1/
HBO documentary Hacking Democracy:
In the 2000 election cycle, electronic voting machines manufactured by Diebold used Microsoft Access as the underlying database for storing vote counts. Only techie oldheads will remember this, but in the world of electronic data storage Access was basically a toy. Access databases did have an audit table (which tracks every change made to the data), but the audit table was hand-editable.
In Volusia County, Florida during the 2000 election Al Gore received negative votes, and I'm sure we all remember how that turned out because everyone on this site is old as fuck so let's temper our excitement this time around.
always thought it suspicious there was soooo many reds when the final count was in.
Let's just say there was fraud, and Kamala did actually win:
Now what? This administration has been blatantly breaking the law, ignoring the constitution and court orders since day fucking 1 without consequence. Will someone with authority finally grow some fucking nuts and arrest the felon(s) over this, even though they could and should have already for numerous other reasons?
It really leads to the question of does winning an election make you the president or is having the power transferred to you all it takes?
I should ask Gerald Ford.
Winning a majority of the electorial votes is what's required to be elected president. There is no federal requirement that the electors of the electorial college vote in accordance with the popular vote of the state they represent. If enough fraud is proven that Harris should have one won it doesn't change the outcome of the electorial vote. According to the laws as they currently are Trump would still be president.
Most likely a mix of everything. I am sure that Republicans tried to win with illegal (vote tampering) and legal (voter suppression, gerrymandering, etc...) methods. Combined with a dumbass population, everything is possible.
I remember asking a few weeks after the election if anyone at all was talking about it being rigged. It seemed at the time everyone just accepted the result. Only in the past month or so have I started seeing talk of it.
Leading up to the election all we were talking about is how trump got ahold of documents through court filings that would show exactly how the voting machines worked. Crazy how thst talking point just fell away.
At this point we know the who, the why, the what, and the how. We need to figure out the where and when.
If a result like this was found in a swing state, I'd be sure it was malicious. In New York, that seems improbable. Someone clever enough to conduct the attack is unlikely to be stupid enough to employ it in a way that creates an obvious anomaly without changing the result.
From what I understand about the issue that I read about in a different article it was about software changes made to a program that many states use, PA was one of them.
I think NY is the only place where it is currently being investigated, but if it happened here I don't doubt it happened elsewhere.
Analysis takes a long time especially if you want it to be able to withstand scrutiny
Does this mean libs will stop blaming voters?
Same difference really.
Edit: Seems I was not very clear, I am saying its equally as stupid (and destructive) for a party to blame voters as it is to blame non voters. You know since you tend to win elections by having more people vote for you then the other guys so villainizing and alienating voters/potential voters seems counter productive.
They won't. They can't even blame the person who's job it is to be a popular candidate with polices that interest the voting public to win.
Which county?
Edit: Rockland. Which is very much a possibility there.
Leftists and liberals all think they're somehow immune to conspiracy theories, but here we are. Nearly everyone commenting or voting in this thread has an opinion based on feelings, and they're looking for evidence to justify their beliefs. "I'm not one to believe conspiracy theories, but..." That's a load-bearing "but" there.
No really: stop for ten seconds and think about why you believe this. Be honest.
Yes, I'm aware of the video that's been linked repeatedly where they can't explain how a small percentage of Trump cultists only voted for Trump and no one else. Imagine that: voters who think the entire system is corrupt and Trump is their savior don't vote for anyone else.
Here's an actual recount in a swing state, and it found nothing.
And as korendian has been trying to tell you, New Square in Ramapo, NY is a tiny, 100% Hasidic village and votes as a monolithic bloc.
There is a strong expectation that residents of New Square will conform to community norms... Those who have not conformed voluntarily have faced vigilante justice, as exemplified by the New Square arson attack and other incidents.
I'm not saying the election was clean. It never is. Red states purge voters they shouldn't, they enact laws to discourage voters and make it more difficult, etc. And sometimes it actually is a conspiracy: 2000 is one example where it really was rigged for Bush through coordinated efforts.
But there's zero persuasive evidence for 2024. If I see some, I'll charge my mind. But not until then.
Edit: The down votes without comment or rebuttal just prove me right.
Seems pretty insignificant in the grand scheme of things. Like I hate the orange fuck as much as the next guy but this won't change shit and is a waste of time that could be spent doing something better.
You do understand that if these machines were compromised, a lot more could be a well. This is the best lawsuit because there are sworn affidavits saying people voted a certain way and the results were different. Literally 0 votes.
The point is that if there was malfeasance, it was likely applied by an algorithm in a way that was meant to be non-obvious. But, if you're applying any kind of broad vote-rigging algorithm to vote tallying equipment across the country...well you're going to screw up in some cases.
The idea would be to first find absolute definitive proof of election fraud in one precinct. Once that's been done, you can use those result it justify broader searches. For example, if it's found that this one area has fraud, then the NY legislature might direct funds to do a hand recount of the whole state. And other states can do the same.
Even if it wouldn't revert the presidential election, if fraud is found in house votes, enough blue states might be able to reverse the elections of Republican House members elected by fraud, enough to flip the balance of power in the House. Plus definitive proof of fraud would immediately make Trump lose all political legitimacy, regardless of whether there is any actual legal mechanism to remove a president from power after being proven to be fraudulently elected...well any mechanism beyond the broken impeachment mechanism.
I see your point. I withdraw my original point.
These data
it's language, if enough people get it "wrong" it's no longer wrong.
Depends on if you're a linguist or an English teacher. Linguists only care about effective communication. Whereas language teachers tend to focus on an arbitrary standard based on tradition and accepted academic norms
Unfortunately most people don't have a linguistics course. Hence why the internet is full of people who think they're "correct" but have terrible communication skills
Look for example at Ramapo 58 district:
Harris only got a single vote in a district that historically votes for Democrats. What are the odds. But maybe Democrats just lost popularity.
But then look at Senate
Now democratic candidate wins by 94.12% what are the odds?
And this is not a single district, there are many others like that.
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I wonder if this is Musks "you wouldnt have won the election without me" quote.
save