Luigi Mangione’s state murder trial postponed indefinitely amid double jeopardy fight

2 months ago by lemmygarden to c/luigimangione

Luigi Mangione’s state murder trial in the killing of UnitedHealthcare CEO Brian Thompson has been postponed indefinitely.
ChicoSuave 115 points 2 months ago

Manhattan District Attorney Alvin Bragg’s office said in a statement that it would fight efforts to end the state case, in part because Mangione’s federal sentence isn’t yet known.

Compared with federal law and that of other states, New York has uncommonly strong protections for defendants facing multiple prosecutions. A state prosecution can be barred if a federal case involving the same course of conduct or criminal transaction ends in a guilty plea or if a jury is sworn.

Pleading guilty was some deep strategy by his team. It's going to be so fucking hilarious when he gets off state charges because of double jeopardy.

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unitedwithme 35 points 2 months ago

Maybe that's why they were so quick to reverse course on the insanity plea or whatever.

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ScoffingLizard 77 points 2 months ago

The rich fear jury nullification will encourage more justice, so they made up some bullshit.

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Airfried 71 points 2 months ago

My god they're going to imprison the poor guy forever without a trial, won't they?

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AngryRedHerring 32 points 2 months ago

The feds didn't get him on murder. My first thought when I saw this is that he has very clever defense attorneys that at least managed to frustrate the state prosecutors by having him plead to a federal non-murder charge that could shut down the State murder case through double jeopardy.

I can't remember any other time in my life that I've been hoping somebody would get off on a technicality

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captainlezbian 1 point 2 months ago
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Hueristic_Autistic 22 points 2 months ago

As a conspiracy theorist: The bigger question is, I wonder what they're distracting us from this week? They're gonna hold him to use his presence as a distraction when they need one. Other than that, he is a suspected murderer and they'll use that as the official reason for holding him but we all know, deep down inside, he's now a tool to be used to distract us.

So we should all be asking the questions: Who are we invading this week? Where's the next biggest arsenal shipment heading? Who's going to be teaming up with Israel this week? Is Germany teaming up with Israel the will of the US or is it defeatism?

What is going on that they just plopped him into the news?

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UnequalExchange 1 point 2 months ago path: 0 25355586 25357281 25559594, hotness: undefined, score: 1, children: 0
ArmchairAce1944 2 points 2 months ago

They cannot do that. If they aren't going to try him, they must release him.

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Etterra 28 points 2 months ago

You must be new here. That's not how the American justice punishment system works.

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UnequalExchange 2 points 2 months ago

.... They MUST release him??!

....ooooh my Sweet Summer Child👨‍🍼

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chuckleslord -4 points 2 months ago

The trial in the state can't move forward until double jeopardy is determined to apply or not. Did you think they just suspended the trial cause evil? Cause I'm not following your statement otherwise

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lemmyvore 33 points 2 months ago

Did you think they just suspended the trial cause evil?

...Yes?

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chuckleslord 8 points 2 months ago

It's suspended because there's no point in holding a trial if it's going to be overturned on double jeopardy. It's indefinite since there's no point in scheduling a follow-up until the question of it being double jeopardy is answered.

Like, guys, stop attributing motivations to what is arguably the only way forward.

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ayyy 0 points 2 months ago

Only way forward? They didn’t have to file the double jeopardy cases in the first place. They chose to, in order to be evil and harass and torture him with the legal system to the maximum extent possible.

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jj4211 4 points 2 months ago

While normally that could be the case, but in this case he isn't getting released either way.

The trial moving forward would be the worse scenario for the defendant. The state charges are worse than the federal charges. The later or never the state case gets tried, the better for him.

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lemmyvore 4 points 2 months ago

The point I was making is that there used to be a human rights violation and against the First and Fifth Amendments to hold someone indefinitely without a trial. But that ended in 2014.

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Funkt4st1c 5 points 2 months ago

Yes. Yes that is evil.

Make a decision or release him. It's literally that easy (im aware courts take longer to do everything but suspending indefinitely is kind of insane)

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chuckleslord 11 points 2 months ago

"Release him"? Dude, he's in jail pending sentencing for his federal case. There is no releasing at this point. This isn't anyone twisting a knife, it's just not scheduling a new court date until the double jeopardy question is resolved. Y'all need to chill and put your heads on before you react to things.

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ApollosArrow 39 points 2 months ago

Well, this man will never be tried.

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Makhno 38 points 2 months ago

Good. He did nothing wrong

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Rothe 18 points 2 months ago

But he will also be stuck as prisoner of this farce of a justice system for ever.

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Dialectical_Specialist 31 points 2 months ago

What does this mean for the non-lawyers still curious?

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vrek 69 points 2 months ago

It means he gets double points if he guesses the right question based on the answer

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Dialectical_Specialist 11 points 2 months ago

This is the half I do know and also why I'm still lost!🤬

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I_Fart_Glitter 29 points 2 months ago

Double jeopardy is being charged with the same crime twice.

His lawyers are arguing that because he has already pled guilty to the federal charges of “interstate stalking resulting in death,” and “cyber stalking resulting in death” that the state charges of second degree murder, weapons possession and false identification should be dismissed.

The state prosecutors are arguing that the state charges are different enough that they should be allowed to go forward with the state trial as well.

Usually all the parts of a single crime that result in separate charges count as the same incident for purposes of double jeopardy.

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kingofras 18 points 2 months ago

Orange hater here: it’s worth pointing out that the federal charges came after the pedopres put pressure on the DOJ to ensure that there would be federal charges on top of the state charges.

Anything the orange turd touches dies.

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vrek 11 points 2 months ago

The honest answer is basically you can't be tried twice for the same crime. Say someone is found dead, the police think you did it, you go on trial and found innocent, the police can't just put you on another trial hoping for a different verdict.

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VonReposti 3 points 2 months ago

What about appeals? In my country you will usually start your case in the city court and can appeal the result to the state court. If it is a special case without clear precedent, you can get approval to try your case at the supreme court. In some edge cases city courts might say you have to start in the state court, but you always get at least one appeal. In very special cases a city court might say you have to start in the state court, but then you can still appeal to the supreme court without approval.

It is not rare for a higher court to reverse the verdict of a lower court completely if the higher court interpreted the law differently. In that case the lower courts will use that as precedence for future cases whether it will be a reversal of the guilty verdict or the punishment.

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ephrin 20 points 2 months ago

Can’t be tried for the same crime twice. So if he pleads guilty in federal court then he can’t be tried again in state court.

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fox2263 3 points 2 months ago

Didn’t the feds want him so to a death sentence though?

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eggpl4nt 15 points 2 months ago

Any death penalty charges were thrown out a while ago iirc. I think life in prison is the max he can get now.

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FundMECFS 7 points 2 months ago

And sentencing guidelines suggest 25-30 years for what he plead guilty too.

So if he gets the guideline amount, good behaviour in prison, and state case dropped, could easily be walking free in his early 50s.

Probably a smart play by him tbh. Plus federal prisons tend to be much less horrible conditions than state prisons.

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jj4211 6 points 2 months ago

Problem is that the crime didn't fit any of the criteria for federal homicide, so they had to settle for lesser charges if they wanted to pursue it as a federal case. A more strategic DOJ probably would have let the state handle it, since it was by all measures the core of the incident would have been a state crime rather than federal.

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NotMyOldRedditName 4 points 2 months ago

The crime charges they had evidence for. The feds fucked up the evidence.

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Tollana1234567 3 points 2 months ago

Bondi tried to encourage it.

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CalypsoGirl 21 points 2 months ago

So meanwhile, has he gotten the healthcare yet that United denied him?? Let us not forget that was the impetus of his prison martyrdom.

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bluelabel 18 points 2 months ago

Confused here.

So it's to plead guilty to a lesser sentence, so in attempt to void the same crime with a heavier sentence?

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NotMyOldRedditName 12 points 2 months ago

Pretty much ya. Specifically because the state murder charges are in NY. This wouldn't fly everywhere.

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