The most convincing argument

2 days ago by Susaga to c/rpgmemes

There's a dozen other RPGs I could have used as well, but Pathfinder is the meme one.

Davel23 77 points 2 days ago

I mean, Pathfinder is literally D&D with a few changes.

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Telodzrum 41 points 2 days ago

Specifically, it’s DND 3.5e with some changes.

So, you have the best full version of DND (3.0) with all the changes made to make the system function the way it was intended and be much more balanced (3.5), with another total revision to balance, the introduction of many new mechanics, over a decade of new content, and an active publisher who makes massive use of the OGL (PF 1.0).

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Telemachus93 21 points a day ago

That's Pathfinder 1e though. Pathfinder 2e is even better in my opinion because it takes what was good from 1e (the world, the customization options, ...) and simplifies play enormously for both the GM and the players to be much more beginner friendly.

I never played DnD 4e but afaik, some of the greatest changes of PF2e have been in DND 4e before and didn't make it to DnD 5e.

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Telodzrum 4 points a day ago

PF2.0 isn’t for me or my tables, with a few exceptions. We want the crunch. I really appreciate what Paizo did with 2.0, but it’s not a game for me.

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ChillCapybara 3 points a day ago

Same. We love the nerdy minutia, leading to inevitable rules lawyering. Keeps the game fresh and surprising

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Grail 4 points 2 days ago

Incorrect. The best D&D edition is 4E, and that's why Draw Steel is the best not-D&D.

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Telodzrum 14 points 2 days ago

This sure is a take.

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sirblastalot 6 points 2 days ago

Surely one of the most takes of all times.

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Lumisal 1 point a day ago

Nah, beat version is Balder's Gate 3 system :p

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kettuli 3 points a day ago

D&D 3.75e

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ilinamorato 16 points 2 days ago

Less so in 2e, but yeah.

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Ketram 4 points 15 hours ago

God I love 2e, I know it isn't as popular as 1e for the hardcore crowd but for actually giving new people who only know DnD something with more substance and interesting character building choice, it is absolutely awesome. I'm also not a big fan of everything stacking like crazy in 1e so there is that.

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ilinamorato 3 points 14 hours ago

I'm a PF2e fan who came from PF1e (we do exist!), and one of my favorite parts is that there aren't really any unviable build options, from either a player side or a GM side. Sure, there are combinations that are more optimal than others, but a player's going to be able to have fun and contribute meaningfully with just about any ancestry/class combination. And since the encounter math actually works, pretty much any mathematically-correct combination of monsters a GM throws at a party will probably present the desired challenge.

So, yes! Agreed.

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albbi 16 points 2 days ago

But the name is pretty dumb. You know what you're getting with D&D. Dungeons, Dragons, probably a fantasy world. Pathfinder is... you go hiking? I have no idea.

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rockSlayer 35 points 2 days ago

It's named after the main adventuring guild in the world, the Pathfinder Society. Which is also the name of Paizo's irl community

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zedgeist 2 points 2 days ago

What's a Paizo?

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rockSlayer 20 points 2 days ago

That's the company that makes Pathfinder and Starfinder, another tabletop roleplaying game in a scifi setting using Pathfinder's rules

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psycotica0 11 points 2 days ago

It's the small device in your BBQ lighter that produces electricity when you hit it, but that's not important right now!

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Doc_Crankenstein 26 points 2 days ago

A "Pathfinder" isn't just hiking. It's a person who goes first into the unknown to make the path so others may follow. It's a name for an adventurer/traveler or another way to say "Trailblazer".

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snek_boi 13 points 2 days ago

To be fair, there’s a lot of people arguing for D&D to be about Dungeons and Dragons. That implies that lots of people play it without neither Dungeons nor Dragons.

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Soup 4 points a day ago

You can’t be serious, right?

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albbi 5 points a day ago

I am serious. And don't call me Right.

But I've never played Pathfinder so I'm just basing my opinion on the name. I've heard good things about it.

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jagermo 9 points 2 days ago

I mean, the three action system alone puts it over DND, imho.

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subverted_per 41 points 2 days ago

Pathfinder is the sooo good. So much customization!

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Zarobi 5 points a day ago

One time I made spider man. But he could only web swing thrice per day, was weaker than every enemy, and kind of just died randomly due to lack of spidey sense. But he had a wicked 6 paragraph alter-ego mechanic that the goblins appreciated

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otacon239 23 points 2 days ago

I’m glad my friend got me into D&D. Definitely daunting at first, but once you start to realize no one is the main character and you can focus on your own story as an individual, the ability to play how you want starts to open up. It’s all about committing to the bit.

That and it takes time. Lots and lots of time.

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DokPsy 21 points 2 days ago

As a player, I can certainly say that the choices my character makes are not the ones I would.

My character spent an entire session running towards the fight where he knew that there were like fifty people fighting the rest of our team. He was looking for the first opportunity to let loose a fireball to assist his teammates.

I, the player, knew that the team was surviving pretty ok and didn't need me to cast anything. I, the player, knew that up casting fireball at forth level was a terrible idea. I, the player, knew there was only one enemy left with 3hp.

My character on the other hand did 32 damage to this lone zombie and alerted the other 150 enemies further away down the battlefield to our presence.

Now, we had to scramble to come up with a way to get an 8h long rest to heal and get spell slots back even though the army was less than 2 hours away and coming towards us.

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bildungsangst 17 points 2 days ago

Step 1: Pathfinder Step 2: Savage Pathfinder Step 3: Other Savage Worlds games Step 4: Become a proper TTRPG nerd

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agamemnonymous 23 points 2 days ago

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Donkter 4 points 2 days ago

An annoying part about wanting to break away from D&D is that all the "experimental" games etc. Get away with having fewer rules. I want another system that can be as complex as D&D but with different focuses.

Forged in the dark is a good example of something close to what I like. What it lacks in combat/interaction diversity it definitely makes up for with the gamified secret base you can customize and the various "down time" interactions you can have.

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agamemnonymous 8 points 2 days ago

That's why I like GURPS. The core mechanics are simple enough, but there are so many optional mechanics you can get as complex as you like.

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Grail 3 points a day ago

See, you want Night Shift: Devil Division. It's based on the Draw Steel engine, so it's about as complex as D&D with great combat rules. But instead of medieval fantasy, it's 90s anime.

https://www.backerkit.com/...

Or possibly Eclipse Phase

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Doc_Crankenstein 4 points a day ago

Eclipse Phase mentioned!

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DarkMetatron 1 point a day ago path: 0 26267042 26268592 26269960 26276957, hotness: undefined, score: 1, children: 0
bob_lemon 4 points 2 days ago

I'm currently on step 2, running Curse of the Crimson Throne. Not the official conversion though, because I bought the 3.5 version (it actually predates Pathfinder 1e) of that AP like 10 years ago. And converting to Savage Worlds is really easy anyway.

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AlligatorBlizzard 2 points a day ago

Uh... I've never actually played a pathfinder campaign. Or D&D. I've mostly played World of Darkness, and a couple of oddball things. I've also sat in on some friends custom campaigns that were absolutely wild. I guess that's not normal, lol.

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JennyLaFae 15 points 2 days ago

Play anything that isn't WotC.

Loved Pathfinder when it came out, currently into Draw Steel.

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RebekahWSD 11 points 2 days ago

I want to play Starfinder again. I had a single session...

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DmMacniel 4 points 2 days ago

I had a short campaign and feel the same.

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ltxrtquq 4 points 19 hours ago path: 0 26266131 26286784, hotness: undefined, score: 4, children: 0
butwhyishischinabook 3 points 2 days ago

Time to meet my weekly quota of recommending that someone try Stars Without Number.

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LovableSidekick 8 points a day ago

My old boss at WotC said his game group played Pathfinder because it was better than D&D.

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Phanlix 3 points 15 hours ago

That's because it is 3.5 DnD, and 3.5 dnd was the best DnD.

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QuantumStorm 5 points a day ago

Come to Lancer! We have crunchy combat and are anti fascist!

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Mirshe 2 points 5 hours ago

I love Lancer, but I have real issues with the lack of balance passes (because printing errata would apparently be unfair for hardcopy players).

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grrgyle 5 points a day ago

I don't understand how everyone doesn't just invent or cobble together their own system. It's so fun! And with cool players, you can build up the rules over time.

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spittingimage 6 points 20 hours ago

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grrgyle 2 points 4 hours ago

You might have to befriend some drama nerds. I used to think tabletop games sucked but it's because I was playing with [unimaginative] engineering types.

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hopesfall 5 points 2 days ago

I tried getting into Pathfinder but the constant buffing is just too tedious and it only gets worse as the game progresses, like way worse.

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Telemachus93 13 points a day ago

You're talking about first edition Pathfinder, aren't you? You should give second edition a try. It takes pretty much only the best from first edition, DnD 4e, a liitle 5e and some original ideas. It's a great and beginner-friendly middle ground between Pathfinder 1e's crunch and DnD 5e's oversimplification.

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hopesfall 3 points 17 hours ago

Yeah I just checked, the game I tried was Pathfinder:Kingmaker and that is indeed the 1st edition.

Sadly all Owlcat Pathfinder games use the 1st edition, but if I ever get the chance I'll revisit Pathfinder, now that I know 2nd edition is indeed worth trying, thanks for the heads up!

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DeadMartyr 4 points a day ago

Reading about it actually makes me think id like it better but I would have to play the variant that removes the linear stat increases so low-level enemies arent trivial.

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Atropos 2 points 18 hours ago

Can you link me to these rules? Sounds interesting. I'm writing a campaign for my group, and I'd like a way to have typical bandits still be an issue throughout the game.

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ltxrtquq 2 points 18 hours ago

https://2e.aonprd.com/Rules.aspx?ID=2762

Proficiency without Level

This variant removes a character's level from their proficiency bonus, scaling it differently for a style of game that's outside the norm. This is a significant change to the system. The proficiency rank progression in Player Core is designed for heroic fantasy games where heroes rise from humble origins to world-shattering strength. For some games, this narrative arc doesn't fit. Such games are about hedging bets in an uncertain and gritty world, in which even the world's best fighter can't guarantee a win against a large group of moderately skilled brigands.

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Atropos 1 point 12 hours ago

Thank you!

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myyass 3 points a day ago

I know it's not a serious RPG but I'm replaying Ni No Kuni 2. I never played it much since my buddies were like what are you doing come play this dumb game with us--tarkov--overwatch; I'm surprised how relaxed and fun it is. I like a decent grind, but can't do the Lineage 2 or other old mmorpg grinds anymore but lighter stuff is fine.

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PattyMcB 3 points 2 days ago

Dark & Darker has entered the chat

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hark 2 points 2 days ago

Fire sdf

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jve 3 points 2 days ago

Love me some Baldurs Gate

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gwl 6 points a day ago

Pathfinder Wrath of The Righteous is pretty damn good

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TipRing 2 points 19 hours ago

Regill did nothing wrong and is unironically the best companion.

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stringere 1 point a day ago

Symbaroum, not the D&D version, is awesome.

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