Out of pocket visit to the Dr, about $15-$20 Urgent care, $25 -$75 Emergency room, $100-$350
These are JUST FOR SHOWING UP AND HAVING INSURANCE, WHICH WE PAY $1000 MONTHLY. The rest of the bill is charged once you leave, mostly 50% of the remaining services.
Most people with work insurance are paying 40-50 percent, and their cost as an employee is calculated as their wages plus their benefits.
I honestly believe Trump is here because we almost went to universal health care.
I honestly believe Trump is here because we almost went to universal health care.
Trump is here because you elected a reasonable black man (not even progressive , just reasonable, willing to comprimise etc) and the racists lost their fucking minds and went "I want the opposite, the guy that's saying this guy came from kenya (lie)".
Mono swelled my throat shut a while ago. Urgent care sent me to the ER. ER looked at my throat, said they can't help Mono. It cost $780 and 6 hours to find out they can't help me.
I once paid 2000 for some tums and a "sorry we can't do anything"
Those costs are bullshit. The cost of the ER used to be much less if you got a referral. Also, I bet most of that is lab work.
Taxes pay more for healthcare per person in the US than the NHS. So taxpayers pay enough taxes for healthcare to get free healthcare, but then they have to pay a premium per month to get healthcare, but then they have to pay for more than the service cost in copays to pay for healthcare.
It is insane how americans are paying for triple or more for healthcare and getting none,
Where the hell are you getting $75 urgent care visits? And $20 doctor visits? I have a high deductible plan and these are like $150 for a doctor and $250 for urgent care.
My wife had a cyst drained and it cost us over $1,000 between 3 visits and them draining it once. Draining it was $600.
Hdhp are predatory. I have a marketplace plan, and I'm paying significant less.
That is FAR too much for monthly insurance, you might want to shop around on marketplace instead of going private
My marketplace cost before assistance is about $1000 per person per month
I'm very sorry to hear that then
Why so they can censor your blood type?
See that's how they track you
In case people are missing the joke the reason is so that they can't find you to bill you.
This doesn't actually work quite like this, but it's a funny joke none the less.
Especially if you've been to that hospital before. And if you have any medical records anywhere.
If you have medical records, do they keep a DNA record of you?
If you don't keep a record of yourself and don't have any ID on yourself when you call, if you don't give a name can they match your DNA or something?
Theoretically this is possible to do if you've avoided any documentation your entire life, or more likely, the hospital staff just dont care enough and forget to find out who you really are before letting you leave.
But realistically the hospital is going to have the cops come in and do a background check on you before even letting you get further care after lifesaving measures. And if you dont give up your information then your most likely getting ICE called on your ass...
none of that is going to happen. hospitals in america are required to provide care in emergencies, no matter if you have documentation or not. you're not getting ICE called (no hospital is going to do that) and no cops are going to come in to do a background check (what would they check? you don't have any ID, you're not required to provide an ID, there's no crime being committed).
That assumes a person isn't a Hispanic day laborer at a hospital during an ICE raid. ICE seems to be focusing on places of work for their targets, but with the current pause on the federal judge's ruling, ICE can violate the fourth amendment anywhere.
ICE doesn't need any ID to look at a person and make a judgement based on physical appearance.
https://www.scotusblog.com/...
In her dissent, Sotomayor argued that the Trump administration, “and now the concurrence” by Kavanaugh, “has all but declared that all Latinos, U.S. citizens or not, who work low wage jobs are fair game to be seized at any time, taken away from work, and held until they provide proof of their legal status to the agents’ satisfaction.”
In Sotomayor’s view, the Trump administration had not shown that it was ultimately likely to prevail on the merits. In particular, she wrote, “a set of facts cannot constitute reasonable suspicion if it ‘describes a very large category of presumably innocent’ people.” “Allowing the seizure,” she said, “of any Latino speaking Spanish at a car wash in Los Angles tramples the constitutional requirement that officers ‘must have a particularized and objective basis for suspecting the particular person stopped of criminal activity.’”
hospitals in america are required to provide care in emergencies
Yes thats why I stated anything further then life saving procedures
Your not getting ICE called
While not called, ICE has arrested/deported hospital patients
you're not required to privide an ID
Yes you are? At the very least you must provide contact information and who you are. Hospitals are looking to make money off of you lol, not paying is a crime
And when I slammed into a mountainside in my car the hospital I stayed at was very pissed I couldn't remember my phone number (I just got a new one) and ran an entire background check on me
The only thing hospitals aren't gonna do is share your medical information with 3rd parties due to HIPPA, they themselves are still gonna collect it tho
(what would they check? you don’t have any ID, you’re not required to provide an ID, there’s no crime being committed).
There is actually a crime committed. Giving a fake name? Obtaining services with no intention of paying for them? Legally speaking that's no different than doing a dine-and-dash at a restaurant. Legally speaking, this is theft or fraud. And the cops could absolutely get involved.
Once the cops are involved, finding your identity will be trivial. Cops find people in situations like this every day. It's not like the people who rob liquor stores tell the clerk their real identity. The hospital will have video of you, they'll have your full identifying information - height, weight, sex, race, plus medically identifying info like scars, blood type, etc.
It's not really about DNA. Deliberately using a false name to escape money owed? In any other context, no one would consider that anything other than fraud. It's only understandable here because of the unique dysfunction of our medical system. But unfortunately, legally speaking, it's no different than any other fraud. Obtaining a good or service with no intention of paying for it is legally simply theft or fraud. It's no different than if you dine and dash at a restaurant. The hospital can absolutely report you to the police in that case. And it's not like the cops are inexperienced with tracking people down of unknown identity. The hospital will have a lot of details about you - your gender, height, weight, age, ethnicity, etc. And your medical treatment may leave behind identifying marks or scars, your blood type, etc. that could make you easily identifiable once caught. And above all else, they'll have video of you in the hospital.
Even if you were a complete unknown in the system, the police could easily track you down. They catch people who rob gas stations with far less info than what you give to a hospital, even using a pseudonym.
Now, if you were actually charged with fraud or theft, a judge would likely go easy on your for this type of crime. Juries would be very sympathetic to someone who did this. So you would probably avoid jail time. But at the very least the court would still order you to pay the hospital what you owe them.
confused european noises
Horrified European noises
poorly executed European A3 to A4 glissando
EDIT: Sorry, I was warming up my voice.
EDIT 2: Astonished European noises
confused Australian noises
To an American it just sounds like "kwah?"
Well yes but there are like 40 more languages other than French
I like this idea but I struggle to believe it would work.
Went to the hospital for a kidney stone a few years ago. When I was released, 3 security guards crowded the front door to the hospital and wouldn’t let me leave for an extra hour and a half because they were adamant I had to pay my bill then and there.
They had all my information, didn’t even bother trying to go through my insurance, just “no, you owe us 2400 right now” and threatening to call the cops.
Me, a 110lbs woman fucked up on dilauded was ready to tussle but ended up paying before I left cause I didn’t want to deal with the police.
They ended up charging me, and then my insurance as well. I talked to my insurance who then bullied them into paying me back. Took 6 months but I did manage to get paid back.
Don’t worry, we’re painfully aware.
Holy shit, that's insane. No wonder the US has triple the healthcare spending of their peers with worse health outcomes.
Yeah for real, the hospital gave no shits until the phrase “insurance fraud” came up and suddenly everyone was super nice and accommodating 😮💨
What the fuck??? I’ve never heard of anything like this! Damn, I’m sorry that happened to you. Was it a for profit hospital or in the south? I’ve never even heard of something like this happening at all…
This was a for profit religious hospital known for their poor ER performance but it was the closest one and I was throwing up from pain in my mom’s backseat so we figured how bad could it be.
Does this even work? Will they even treat you or let you leave without ID?
theyre only required by law to stabilize you. youre not getting 'cured'.
if you lose a finger for example, they don't have to put it back on.. only prevent you from bleeding out.
Stabilize for anyone unfamiliar is
Probably not going to die in the next 24 hours from easily identifiable injuries.
Because then they can become liable.
You can be very unhealthy with multiple broken bones, cancer, be dying softly and still be "stable".
Yes they will treat you. But they will harass the shit out of you. I couldn’t properly identify myself or another victim after a critical accident and the other person almost lost their arm. I was failing all the other questions too (date, president, etc) but they wouldn’t stop asking like clockwork. It took hours to get an MRI and xray. I had two broken vertebrae in my upper back and severely concussed. They just kept giving the other passenger blood transfusions but refused to operate. They finally did a temp surgery on their arm but didn’t do a full surgery until after they were identified and it was confirmed they were well insured (union). It was a mess. Hospital and medical insurance took their entire settlement as payment for that shitty service too. We were struck by a drunk driver. Oh, and we both had stellar insurance (different unions but good insurance) and neither ambulance would take it. 5k for mine and I think theirs was more. And again, the whole settlement went to the insurance to pay the hospitals for that stellar bedside manner of letting me suffer for hours confused af and them almost die and lose their arm. Second surgeon was not happy. The other guy also was checked in as a John Doe at another hospital and they lost all of their teeth and most of their lower jaw. Also horrible delayed service. They care more about figuring out who you are so they know you’re “in network” than treating you.
They are legally required to stabilize you. That is to say, they they will not heal you, they'will not cure you. They get you stable enough to get you the fuck out of the door.
If you have cancer. They will not do shit.
If you have a broken bone. They will straighten it, if they can, no cast, and kick you r the fuck out. You will still have a broken bone, and you will still need surgery to heal it.
Been bounced before with broken bones. It sucked.
They will not do jack shit to straighten a broken bone. They make you sit in triage until you give up and leave or escort you out by security if you raise a stink.
Sat in triage for 38 hours before with a broken leg.
Minus the transphobia.
Yes, I know, perfect is the evil of good, but good healthcare is a neverending process: we must always try to improve it for the people.
Having recognition of the gender and enabling informed consent would go a long, long way, in eliminating waiting lists and problems that indeed also affect cis people.
Yeah, though it's not confined to just the NHS given some of the recent rhetoric I've been seeing. Obviously the transphobia is bad but it's potentially marginally better than also being bankrupted by it. Not trying to step on the very real issue of the transphobia here though. Sucks that we don't really have any good parties to be voting for right now...
I mean, there's the Greens, Sinn Feinn, and the Scottish National Party. I'd argue they're pretty close to good for the average worker. Corbyn's new party would also be nice. But the real issue is FPTP. If that were abolished in favour of proportional representation (and Green favours that), that'd help.
Yeah I should have clarified, there's some decent ones but the chance of them getting anything is fleeting. I voted green last election actually.
I went to the hospital for a cough (it was ultimately pneumonia). It was a holiday so Drs weren't open.
During intake they determined I was a "threat to myself and others", detained me, and drugged me.
They tried to make me foot the bill and sent me to collections without any prior notice months later.
I disputed it with credit. And explained the situation, how I was held against my will and how they exceeded the scope of care.
The credit bureau surprisingly sided with me and cleared my credit of any wrong doing.
I later found out that several American hospitals were needlessly drugging adolescents and it was a huge problem.
The lack of oversight for sectioning someone for anything is very scary. There is no way to fight it really and also YOU have to foot the bill. Let alone the trauma of being held against your will.
100%. I'll never ever step foot in that hospital again.
They denied me phone calls to my family for over 24hrs so they were worried and looking for me.
I'll never forget the slap in the face when I got out and they billed me 50$ for a grilled cheese sandwich and saltines.
Why? What benefit could I possibly have to keep my identity a secret in a hospital emergency? They need access to my NHS records so they know my medical history, blood type, current medications, etc.
They'd treat me regardless, but it would be very weird and suspicious if I didn't identify myself. They might even call the police because of it, because who does that?
Americans.
Yes this is absolutely an American thing, if you can avoid it at the least don't take the ambulance unless you want a $5000 bill
Take just a moment to appreciate how shite the US healthcare system is that this post is sound medical advice.
You let your doctors know your blood type? What if they use that to find out who you are and bill you
Godspeed 🫡
I recently had my first medical emergency, and I'm in the USA. It actually is pretty abysmal.
In my case, I wasn't literally on death's door, but I had an injury that I could not stop the bleeding from (and obviously could not tell how bad things were).
So, the first responder was able to control the bleeding during the ambulance ride. And once that part was done, they moved right into the ID, billing info, and insurance info right there in the ambulance.
I still needed additional emergency care, of course. So, we arrive at the emergency room, they check my vitals, and then as soon as the nurse is done with that part, and before I received any treatment, they were asking me for the same ID, billing info, and insurance questions.
Even with insurance that costs nearly $1,000 USD a month, I had to pay entirely for the ambulance ride and the emergency room doctor's fees (both were classified as out of network), as well as the co-insurance (20% of the inflated "insurance" cost for treatment that was "in-network"), and so on.
So I can understand why this type of advice is going around.
On the other hand, if your emergency room visit requires follow-up care and/or prescription medication, giving false (or no) identifying information will complicated that part so I hope you have good black/grey market connections or a relative with a pharmacy's worth of old prescriptions they didn't finish.
Oh, hello, yes you are probably a real human then! Nice to meet you!
Oh shit they're on to me
Uhhh
Health insurance provides an important service to the economy, making sure that consumers have access to a variety of providers. Really it's about protecting Americans' freedom of choice when it comes to their health and bodies!
We have.
We as a collective society said we want that for the past two decades.
But then our oligarchy class decided we didn't want it so now we don't have it.
Honestly, fuck you. You think we don't want public Healthcare? You think we have any power here at all??? You think our votes mean fucking anything?? Christ, the dude in charge of our country is so monstrously evil that his supporters have bumper stickers saying "felon for president". Rich people run our country, no matter what anyone else pretends, and there's nothing we can do because they've slowly over decades made our population not give a fuck. I voted, but ONE THIRD of our country didn't. Get real.
Last year I had to be taken to the hospital for an emergency and stayed for three days.
This is how much I was billed:
Fuck that, I've paid good money for my medical insurance, the company can damn well start paying the hospital! I've got a lot more in common with the nurses, doctors, and support staff than I do with insurance parasites, I want them justly recompensed for their labor. Will the company try to renege on the contract by refusing as much coverage as they think they can get away with? That's a lawsuit for another day, when I'm feeling better, and I'll recruit the hospital administrators to my side.
My brother in Christ, are you assuming the hospital (and the pharmacy) isn’t also owned by the insurance company? And do you think that the profits will get passed on to the laborers?
My brother in Christ, are you assuming the hospital (and the pharmacy) isn’t also owned by the insurance company?
In most places they aren't, and tbh its not always a bad thing when they are. The kaiser permanente model actually leads to better outcomes than in most hospital networks because it actually incentivizes preventative care.
It also gives them no incentive to try to control the cost of care or negotiate strongly on their customers’ behalf as an insurance company.
Right, but they aren't just operating as an insurance company. They also own and operate the hospital, meaning there has to be a balance between the profitability of the hospital network weighted against the profitability of the insurance company.
In the end, it usually means that there isn't a competition between the insurance and providers, rather two parties working together to manage cost while providing better service.
Which means it pays to provide preventative care, it pays to educate their patient population, and it pays to provide outcome based medicine.
Vertical integration of healthcare is a lot closer to something like universal care than what you usually see in america. It's not perfect, but it's usually better than the current norm.
Mine is not. UCLA exists for the benefit of UCLA, but fortunately that includes providing excellent medical care in order to keep their reputation as an outstanding teaching hospital.
It's not. UCLA exists for the benefit of UCLA, but fortunately that includes providing excellent medical care in order to keep their reputation as an outstanding teaching hospital.
Even in the US this doesn't seem like a good idea.
no visitors also means there's no one to provide medical history or advocate for you if you become too sick to speak for yourself. So you do need at least one person who can be trusted to also uphold the same level of secrecy for your benefit. MUTUAL AID, PEOPLE. The community needs to resist.
Now that said all of this is gonna go fits up once they gut EMTALA and it becomes legal to hold off on CPR until they can rifle through your wallet for an insurance card.
This idea unfortunately isn't a great option for those with chronic illnesses. Having a medical history on file is often critical for recieving the correct care, and you can't have your cake and eat it.
Either they know who you are, your history, and where to bill to, or they don't know who you are, your history, and where to bill to.
As always the real answer is universal healthcare. But I totally get it for those who are in the position to do so.
Bruh, they could just use your blood samples to identify you.
Also, the US could soon change its laws to no longer require hospitals to treat you for an empergency, so they could ask you to pre-pay, like they do in State-Capitalist PRC where I'm from.
It's real easy. They're gonna have a different nurse ask you every 15 minutes for your insurance information, and if that fails, they'll assign a social worker to sit with you and begin applying for medicaid benefits on your behalf. They will slowwww your treatment because they know you aren't indigent and this point, you're either crazy or playing them. They may call for a transfer to a psychiatric hospital, they'll certainly be making moves at this point you want to avoid. They know how to get their money. Charity care isn't just a pot you can freely dip in or we'd all be doing it.
But I like the spirit of the thing.
"Show up as a ghost and leave as one."
Yeah, I don't think they thought that particular sentence through, lmao
I've honestly wondered why i don't hear more people doing this?
How would you hear about it if it "never happened"?
They forgot the most important rule...always pay in cash. They can trace your information through your insurance provider, so it's best not to have any.
(edit...I guess I needed an /s, afterall.)
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I had to think about this for an embarrassingly long time before I realise this was America and they don't have the NHS. In the UK you should absolutely provide your identity to the hospital, so it can go on your medical record.
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