Apu sitting in the corner out of picture

a month ago by Themosthighstrange to c/lemmyshitpost

Davel23 212 points a month ago

Te be fair, Troy McClure stopped appearing after his voice actor was killed.

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Fuckswearwords 70 points a month ago

Same for Isaac Hayes (Chef), though less murdered and more natural causes.

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Thebeardedsinglemalt 127 points a month ago

Chef was written out because Isaac Hayes lost his shit when South Park went hard on Scientology. They killed off the character well before Hayes died.

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Rooskie91 226 points a month ago

IDK What suit your talking about. Isaac Hayes suffered a stroke after the episode aired, and the Church of Scientology released a statement on his behalf. Hayes' son set the record straight over a decade after his dad died. Here's the tweet.

For over 14 years, people have speculated about why my father @isaachayes left South Park. I’m here to set the record straight. My dad did not quit South Park. Scientology did.

After the episode Trapped in the Closet aired in 2005, my father suffered a stroke just a few months later that left him unable to speak or make decisions on his own. He was not in any condition to resign from anything. The truth is, someone else within his Scientology circle made that decision and quit the show for him.

He loved being the voice of Chef. He loved the character. He loved connecting with fans. He would joke with people who recognized his voice, and he truly enjoyed being part of the show.

The narrative that he quit because he was offended by the satire is not true. That was a cover story created by others. My father never got to speak for himself because his health robbed him of that chance.

So now I am speaking for him. He did not leave South Park willingly. He was forced out by illness and by people who did not have his best interest at heart.

This is for anyone who loved Chef. This is for anyone who admired my father’s work. This is the truth about what really happened.

Here is the original tweet. Hayes son has also said this in an interview.

Hayes previously stated that although he didn't like those jokes, he got them and still liked being a part of the show. I'm pretty sure South Park made jokes about Scientology before this episode. So why wouldn't he have left earlier if that was what he had a problem with?

Here is even more info about it.

So we can all stop down voting OP for being correct.

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TargaryenTKE 8 points a month ago

Lol I love how you and I basically made the same arguments against two different people trying to shift blame away from Scientology. It's almost like nobody listened to Kyle when he said the most important line from that episode aka Matt and Trey talking directly to the audience:

We shouldn't be mad at Chef. We should be mad at that fruity little club for scrambling his brains

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MehBlah -2 points a month ago path: 0 24804887 24805047 24805071 24806533 24822029, hotness: undefined, score: -2, children: 3
Davel23 36 points a month ago

No, Chef was removed at the request of one of his family members because of his association with Scientology. Isaac Hayes died two years after the removal of Chef.

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OS2Warp 2 points a month ago path: 0 24804887 24805047 24805117 24811781, hotness: undefined, score: 2, children: 0
MehBlah 19 points a month ago

Chef was written out for being a hypocritical scientologist who was fine with trashing everyone up until they put cruise in the closet. They killed him off in a you ain't ever coming back way. He died two years after they killed him off in the show.

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TargaryenTKE 12 points a month ago

I think you're forgetting two key factors here: one is that he suffered a stroke in 2006 and didn't really do much of ANY work after that. According to one of his 11 sons 3 sons (out of 11 kids, holy shit my dude), Isaac Hayes III:

Isaac Hayes did not quit South Park; someone quit South Park for him. What happened was that in January 2006 my dad had a stroke and lost the ability to speak. He really didn’t have that much comprehension, and he had to relearn to play the piano and a lot of different things. He was in no position to resign under his own knowledge. At the time, everybody around my father was involved in Scientology — his assistants, the core group of people. So someone quit South Park on Isaac Hayes’ behalf. We don’t know who. ... My father was not that big of a hypocrite to be part of a show that would constantly poke fun at African-American people, Jewish people, gay people — and only quit when it comes to Scientology. He wouldn’t be that hypocritical.

Now whether you choose to believe all that or not is up to you, but the other key factor you forgot to consider is that Scientology IS a cult. From the limited amount of data we've been able to gleam from their internal workings, they have a habit of forcing their members to constantly push themselves beyond their limits, regardless of what any medical doctor would advise; because in their warped worldview, all faults or shortcomings, mental and physical, are all just the result of Thetans and can be overcome, regardless of the health of the individual. We have some anecdotes of people who have left with claims that the 'Chirch' would use typical cult behaviors that all amounted to increased control over their victims: borderline starvation, massive amounts of physical exercise to promote exhaustion, recontextualizing their worldview to make all this horseshit more acceptable, etc.

Anyway, my point is, Hayes died at the age of 65 after a recurrence of the previously mentioned stroke and was found lying on the floor next to a still-running treadmill. In my (unprofessional) opinion, Scientology killed him, simple as that. I wouldn't go so far as to say it was deliberate, nor that Hayes was ENTIRELY guilt-free (he did still join them initially), but the fact is that the last several years of his life were almost completely controlled for him and the people behind those decisions clearly put the CoS first and Hayes at a very distant second

Edit: I originally misspoke and said Hayes had 11 sons. He had 11 children, but only 3 were sons

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MehBlah 5 points a month ago

None of it was mentioned at the time. It seems more likely it is revisionist history. Which is understandable since its originating from the family. I know what scientology is. As I know what a cult is. A cult is a small unpopular religion. A religion is a large popular cult. Which one hubbards brainfart low grade fantasy fiction falls under is debatable and redundant. He gave up his control and that is on him and only him. Blaming a MLM scheme hiding as a religion for a death is pointless since there was nothing that prevented him from breaking away as others have done.

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osanna -5 points a month ago

didn't isaac hayes have an argument with matt and trey, because hayes was a massive figure in the scientology space, and south park making an episode criticising scientology? that's what i heard.

edit: just saw the replies below. Yes, i thought so.

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SpaceCowboy 6 points a month ago

I recall Matt and Trey said he wasn't all that upset, he just wouldn't take part in that specific episode. But then after the episode aired there was a falling out. But maybe he had a stroke?

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osanna 1 point a month ago

I'm not 100% on the deets, but i know there was something about scientology. He did have a stroke though, but that was after the south park/scientology stuff though.

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OS2Warp 6 points a month ago path: 0 24804887 24805047 24806436 24811790, hotness: undefined, score: 6, children: 1
osanna 3 points a month ago

Ah. Thanks

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BigBoyShuanzee 69 points a month ago

It was already said about Troy Mclure. I'm still annoyed that a 3rd rate Indian comedian said "Apu is making us all look bad" Ahh yes Apu who is literally the hardest working person (besides Smithers) Apu a man who had 5 women dating him at one time. A man who got the hottest girl ever (The Squishish girl).. They decided that was offensive and against their race.

All I've got is "OI MISTER PRIME MINISTER" and "900 DOLLARYDOOS???"

I guess I'm entitled because 900 dollarydoos is fucking hilarious and I love being insulted.

I have some long lost Scottish heritage (ask the English and the Catholic Church why I can't look up my history) and I Absolutely love everything about Groundskeeper Willie even his creepy phase of filming couples in their cars... "EVERY SCOTTISH PERSON DOS EET'

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Etterra 33 points a month ago

Don't forget that Apu was an excellent hard-working, small business owning, immigrant father.

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postmateDumbass 13 points a month ago

Maybe that WAS the problem.

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Skullgrid 31 points a month ago

Ahh yes Apu who is literally the hardest working person (besides Smithers)

It's reinforcing a stereotype. Apu was an interesting character when they expanded him, but he dealt with a lot of stereotypes and had a white guy voicing a fairly stereotypical guy.

Hank Azaria (or whoever it is voicing him) is cool with it, maybe check out his perspective

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Katana314 11 points a month ago

I’m sometimes a bit concerned that I do buy into the “white actors voice them better” trope.

I think last major instance I recall is Widowmaker from Overwatch. The fake French accent is generally much easier to hear their lines through, and they can build their vocal focus on the “sexy spy” theme.

It could be just that English actors are better at understanding cultural expectations to build on for their audience. I’ve had a hard time building investment in some characters with certain heavy native accents, which is tricky to think about.

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postmateDumbass 8 points a month ago

I think preventing people from playong around with accemts and voices from other cultures is fascist, kills play, and blocks some pathways to empathy.

i guess we could do genetic testing before casting paid roles so all intended accemts will be allowed.

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Skullgrid -1 points a month ago

blocks some pathways to empathy.

explain how, postmate Dumbass.

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Skullgrid 4 points a month ago

this whole thing sounds like desert camel music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LR511iAedYU

Don't worry, you don't need to watch the whole thing. He repeats his point multiple times :

Basically, by catering to generic ideas instead of authentic ones, you are being robbed of cultural exposure and reinforcing biases and simple perspectives you have instead of growing.

Yeah, when someone does a stereotypical accent you associate with something, it conforms more to your ideas of how your language sounds when made by a foreigner. It doesn't make you understand what the accent actually sounds like, and WHY it sounds that way. It's nice for you, because it panders to you, instead of treating you like an adult.

Also, it's disingenuous to bring french accents into this, since the main problem is that the stereotypes being presented of ethnic minorities are often used to ridicule them, and deny them prosperity. That's the difference, the french guy is ,moving from one well of place to the next and people aren't going to deny him promotions or whatever. However, to Indian people, or children of Indians, patterns of bullying and marginalisation still exist and are exasperated by the stereotypes.

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BigBoyShuanzee 5 points a month ago

Hank Azaria voices many characters and is a very talented guy. I don't blame him for being uncomfortable voicing Apu

Apu had so many silly and offensive things towards Indians.. But Apu is (As I said in my original comment) a great and wonderful character and is one of the better off characters in the show.

The only time Apu is a bad guy is when he's selling expired meat or when he's cheating on his wife.

The rest of the time he's busting his arse and being so damned hard working.

Groundskeeper Willie is a drunk, hate filled, Scottish borderline serial killer.. All okay it's because he's Scottish.

I don't care either way, I like Apu and I like Willie but I don't like that a 3rd rate comedian attacked Apu just to get famous and No one cares about the harmful stereotypes of Ellie.. I don't even care.. Actually I'm tired of this, I don't care.

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qualia 1 point a month ago

What “third rate comedian” are you even talking about.

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BigBoyShuanzee -1 points a month ago

Exactly, none of us even know who he is. But he felt he was important enough to create an entire documentary about Apu, crying that Apu was making Indians seem bad when Apu was crushing it.

Then if you payed attention I talked about how unhappy I was that the Simpsons let us Australians off easy.

I want to be attacked on all fronts because I'm a ridiculous human being.

"dickhead" is something you call someone you like in Australia.

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rbos 11 points a month ago

I'm pretty sure 'dollarydoos' is honourary Aussie now. It was in Bluey.

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theblurstoftimes 7 points a month ago

That’s a bloody outrage it is! Hey Tony!!

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HerbGrower 4 points a month ago

Making fun of nationalities is fine as long as it is funny enough.

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HuePony 3 points a month ago

Aside from public remove reason, that character was become boring. I would expected them to remove him anyway

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magnetosphere 52 points a month ago

I haven’t watched the Simpsons in SOOOOO long. They really benched Apu?

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BarbecueCowboy 73 points a month ago

The voice actor maybe felt bad about being a white guy reinforcing indian stereotypes, or maybe felt pressured, but either way decided that he wasn't going to voice him anymore, and they decided not to replace him and instead just never give Apu a line again.

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magnetosphere 35 points a month ago

Thanks. Not replacing him was an odd choice, though.

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skisnow 29 points a month ago

not so much; the topic had kind of become a whole thing within the comedy/entertainment circuit on account of Hari Kondabolu making a documentary about it.

It was a detailed and nuanced discussion about the wider nature of invisible racism, and therefore attracted a ton of kneejerk reactions from people who hadn't watched it but sure as hell had opinions (edit: oh look, after I wrote that, one of them showed up in the comments lol). In the end it was just easier to let it lie than get tied up in an intractable discussion on whether an Indian person playing up an Indian stereotype for the entertainment of a mainstream audience is still harmful or not

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mojofrododojo 7 points a month ago

Yep. And Hank Azaria has a fuckton of other characters to voice, and there's a huge universe, so no Apu isn't really a show killing problem.

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Dookieman12 13 points a month ago

Yeah, all those stereotypes of Indian people being successful business owners, loving husbands, dedicated fathers, and all around decent folks really give the wrong idea about Indian people.

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barooboodoo 3 points a month ago path: 0 24805142 24805231 24813375 24819769, hotness: undefined, score: 3, children: 0
ryannathans 1 point a month ago

F

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Zozano 31 points a month ago

Watching this video made me realise that benching Apu was a mistake. Because as a character, he is not punched down on, he is reliably one of the more considerate and nuanced characters in the show. He's not a Cletus-like character, and the jokes about his Indian heritage are not mean spirited.

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skisnow 9 points a month ago

Did you watch the documentary itself, or did you just watch that 45 minute takedown of it presented by a white guy wearing USA flag shorts telling us why he thinks Hari Kondabolu doesn't understand racism?

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dillekant 7 points a month ago

I did watch the docco, and unfortunately it doesn't really make it's case coherently or entertainingly. That's pretty bad because the creator is meant to be a comedian, and he really should have been able to ruin Shearer's career but he's just not all that great.

As for Apu, the reason he sucks is that he started as a caricature but somehow ended up a main character, and the creators have kind of painted themselves in a corner. Is he meant to be a wacky stereotype like the Italian chef, or are we meant to have pathos, like Skinner? Add that to the fact that there just aren't many Indians on screen, and you have Apu as mostly the only Indian representation on TV.

It's anachronistic, orientalist, and just a bit lame to do jokes like that. Heck, it was lame when they created the character, that's why the specific note was not to make him Indian, but Shearer did it anyway.

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Zozano 1 point a month ago

Evidently you dont know Max, he is very self aware, and is a leftist.

That character you see there on the screen isn't an animated version of himself, it's a character - he's far more pityful than the real Max, and references in this video how his own appearance is going to trigger judgement, as he looks like a skinhead.

In any case, I don't need to watch the documentary fully, if its ideas are represented fairly, right?

So, then, does it present the ideas of the documentary fairly?

Because you are inferring it doesn't, even though you likely haven't watched the video I posted.

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Duamerthrax 0 points a month ago

As much as I think Apu is a fine character, hotdiggedydemon went alt-right culture wars a long time ago.

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Zozano 1 point a month ago

I must've missed this? What has he said which made you think about him like this?

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Duamerthrax 0 points a month ago

His "eat the rich" video was enough. Honestly, I never liked his old pony.mov videos either. He always seemed like an ironic mlp fan.

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jay 33 points a month ago

Lisa Miller is in the latest Scott Pilgrim game.

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forkDestroyer 1 point a month ago

Why was she apparently removed before this? I never read the comics.

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jay 1 point a month ago

I'll be honest, I don't know enough about the lore to answer you on this.

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frog 25 points a month ago

What are you talking about. Apu's right there. Ice got him.

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bzLem0n 28 points a month ago

Nope that's Gandhi from Clone High.

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valar 20 points a month ago

Who's in the red sweatshirt?

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DonGirses 26 points a month ago

Tord from Eddsworld

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No_Money_Just_Change 3 points a month ago

Tord is back (e.g. in the end or tords next big adventure)in eddsworld and was allways at least a repeated cammeo

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ThatWeirdGuy1001 1 point a month ago

Yeah but didn't he move back to Canada at some point making it difficult for them to include him?

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Godort 7 points a month ago

Tord from Eddsworld

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limer 14 points a month ago

Who is the handsome cat?

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JasonDJ 64 points a month ago

Not sure if serious or not, it's Pepé le Pew. He's a rapey skunk and French stereotype (but I repeat myself).

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Skunk 33 points a month ago

Merde…

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JasonDJ 46 points a month ago

For anybody not familiar, he was a Loony Tune. His gimmick was he would fall helplessly in love with any black cat who happened to get white paint on her (or possibly his, not here to judge) back.

Pepé was very...self-imposing. To put it mildly. He would not last long in a "No means no" world.

But I'd never thought it'd be 1am, and I'd be a 41 year old man proactively explaining horny skunks to kids on the internet who have never experienced it first hand.

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FatVegan 15 points a month ago

I just thought about the whole pepe thing last week and i don't really get it to be honest. I loved looney tunes as a kid, don't really care for it now, and have no reason to defend pepe at all. But ifeel like removing him was just a weak ass attempt to pretend to be the good guys. He was certainty problematic and all, but that was the whole point. He was never the good guy, or the funny guy. Even as a child i realised that he was scummy and odd. I'm oly going off memory here from a show i watched over 30 years ago, but he was never really endorsed or bugs bunny never told him that he's cool and he ahould just continue to force himaelf on that cat. He was a caricature of a slimebag that probably every girl and woman at least once in their lifetime encounters. Removing him is just like saying these people don't exist, don't worry. I know it's not that deep, but to me it feels like when they removed the D&D episode from community where señor chan painted his face black because he was a dark elf and then felt good about themselves because they solved racism.

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Kolanaki 6 points a month ago

I feel like Fifi from Tiny Tunes was supposed to be a more PC Pepe, but they had absolutely no ideas to make her more of a thing. Did she even have a gimmick? I just remember her name and that she was purple.

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Skunk 3 points a month ago

Oh I knew that, I’ve seen it before getting to the age of 43 kiddo :)

I just never saw the French attitude because I was French (still is), hence the "merde".

My name isn’t from that cartoon (Pépé le putois) but from a certain plant… I was a teenager when I choose it. Now that I’m an irresponsible adult I tell people that it’s Skunk the animal and I use cute skunks as profile pictures.

But that’s a lie, let it be our little secret 🤫

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DagwoodIII 2 points a month ago

I wish I could remember the name of the novel. It's pretty recent.

Author and hero are both gay men. The hero is fighting a vampire/zombie/cannibal cult. Book is full of massacres, torture, and about a dozen human sacrifices.

There's a trigger warning about bad language at the start of the book.

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Agent641 13 points a month ago

Rapey skunk

But enough about the US president...

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SethTaylor 9 points a month ago

Eddsworld! Neat

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SwissArmyKazoo 7 points a month ago

If I'm remembering correctly, Pepe will be appearing in the upcoming Coyote vs Acme movie.

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HertzDentalBar 4 points a month ago

Why is Ghandi there? The show itself was canceled, it's been so long, anyone care to explain?

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OldChicoAle 8 points a month ago

They had to remove him from the reboot cuz people got butthurt.

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HertzDentalBar 9 points a month ago

There was a reboot... Fuck Im so outta the loop. Not that I really care. Shit I only realized they remade Moana like 2 weeks ago. Fucking wack ass shit.

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spicehoarder 0 points a month ago

No no no, you're making me fall asleep, to death bro. The line is; "Say WHAAAAAT"

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pyre 3 points a month ago

so is lindsey graham

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DragonTypeWyvern 3 points a month ago

Somehow, Lisa Miller has returned

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