Capitalist Corporations: .... hmmmm .... I guess there's no choice .... artificial human breeding it is!
Why aren't you creating more workers??
10 months ago by balderdash to c/lemmyshitpost
ininewcrow 86 points 10 months ago
ChicoSuave 32 points 10 months ago
Capitalism would also charge for every part of the process, raising the price as some techno feudal lord thinks they can find the right balance between extinction pricing and maximum shareholder value.
WanderingThoughts 18 points 10 months ago
Then they do the calculation on the costs to raise the children and decide it's not economically viable.
AA5B 12 points 10 months ago
It’s always economically viable, just a matter of tracking all the expenses and adding it to the child’s debt. As soon as it’s old enough to work you can garnish it’s wages for all that unpaid debt
ininewcrow 4 points 10 months ago
It would be economically viable up to a certain age. And if you maintained a certain age average, costs could be easily maintained to sustainable levels.
When you start analyzing the world and people as a series of costs and expenses, it's very easy to find solutions.
As humans, we've already done that many times before .... most recently in the 1940s on an industrial scale .... we are capable of doing it again.
etchinghillside 70 points 10 months ago
You said ban birth control and porn? Got it.
TipsyMcGee 7 points 10 months ago path: 0 19008449 19011525 19011873 19017014, hotness: undefined, score: 7, children: 3
outhouseperilous 20 points 10 months ago
Also homosexuality, except for the wealthy.
BackgrndNoize 20 points 10 months ago
So that's why suddenly there's all this interest in banning porn
Quetzalcutlass 20 points 10 months ago
They're taking the opposite approach.
In the past families had a bunch of kids because they needed extra laborers to stay afloat, plus childhood mortality rates were so dire they needed spares to cover for the ones who wouldn't make it.
We're already seeing pushes towards removing child labor laws, and RFK Jr is well on his way to ensuring death from easily preventable diseases makes a comeback.
sad_detective_man 175 points 10 months ago
This raises birth rates
trashgirlfriend 37 points 10 months ago
I was born with a penis but Luigi Mangione activated my ovaries
cannon_annon88 3 points 10 months ago
Allegedly.
sharkfucker420 33 points 10 months ago
Never give up 💪
Gammelfisch 14 points 10 months ago
Nothing is impossible.
Jiggle_Physics 4 points 10 months ago
queing?
dream_weasel 8 points 10 months ago
Full auto.
jimjam5 74 points 10 months ago
Growing up, I was of the mindset that I would have got married and started a family by this point in my life. But as of the last few years, my thoughts have done just about a 180.
Even if I was currently with someone/married, I’m pretty sure I wouldn’t want to raise kids in this day and age in the US (the bullet dodged me when my ex-girlfriend used plan b after we got intimate without protection). I think best case scenario for me now would be DINK, but gotta find someone that can put up with my dumpster fires first.
ininewcrow 43 points 10 months ago
Just find someone with similar dumpster fires, then you'll both burn in the passions of what you love
Also, thanks for mentioning DINK - Double Income No Kids .... never heard of that before and now I learned something new.
OrteilGenou 5 points 10 months ago
Like yuppies was a play on hippies except it stood for Young Urban Professional
ininewcrow 3 points 10 months ago
My favourite was WASP
White Anglo Saxon Protestant
BackgrndNoize 5 points 10 months ago
Same dink is my dream but hard to find partners who are into it, or who you like and who like you
Newsteinleo 61 points 10 months ago
A friend of mine has three kids and works 70 hours a week. He is not able to make enough to support his family, and social services have been cut so much that his only option is to take out a personal loan, which will only make his problem worse.
BackgrndNoize 23 points 10 months ago
14 hours leaves you barely 2 hours of personal time in a day. That's barely enough to just eat and maybe relax but then if you have 3 kids even that time is gone taking care of them. How and why would anyone put themselves through this, like after the first or second kid wouldn't your own limits become apparent
BackgrndNoize 9 points 10 months ago
Yeah didn't think about that but that's probably another 2 hours of energy spent on driving, because everything is spread out and there's no good public transportation options outside of specific areas
Newsteinleo -1 points 10 months ago
Some people find themselves in places where they lack the choice to limit themselves to two children when an accident happens. Not everyone has the resources to travel to a place where they would be able to make a choice.
BackgrndNoize 5 points 10 months ago
What, are you using the word places as a metaphor or literally, cause I've never heard of a location where you have to have more kids than you can afford, other than maybe villages where kids are seen as free labor
Newsteinleo 11 points 10 months ago
Currently, in the US there are States were you can get an abortion and States were you cant. So, if you have an unplanned pregnancy you are kind of fucked.
JandroDelSol 2 points 10 months ago
abortions are becoming increasingly illegal
Gammelfisch -1 points 10 months ago
In the USA? If yes, the US is a sick country in regard to income distribution, labor laws, healthcare and public services. However, if your friend voted MAGA, zero sympathy and he/she can carry on.
Newsteinleo 8 points 10 months ago
I don't think children should suffer regardless of who their parents voted for, I find your callousness as bad as bad as those that voted for Trump.
eugenevdebs -1 points 10 months ago
However, if your friend voted MAGA, zero sympathy and he/she can carry on.
Yeah those kids deserve to be neglected! Fuck em!
UnderpantsWeevil -4 points 10 months ago
However, if your friend voted MAGA, zero sympathy
It's so bizarre to see liberal politician after liberal politician promise economic reforms common to the rest of the industrial world, then fail to deliver over and over again.
And then someone sees a ghoul like Hilary Clinton or Joe Biden running at the top of the ticket, or an American Psycho like Newsom or Adams or Cuomo trying to hijack any semblance of progressive politics for their own vainglory. And they say "Nope, not supporting that garbage".
Then everything that comes after is on their heads, somehow.
Not on the heads of the trillionaire plutocrats setting economic policy. Or military leadership goading us into the next war. Or evangelical hucksters selling snake oil to desperate people.
Nope. Always the fault of Joe Dirt when Obama can't win his third term.
mrgoosmoos 45 points 10 months ago
why would I want to bring somebody into this world. they'd only have to fight for basic things like "let's be nice to each other" and "maybe we should pool our money to spend it on big things that benefit us all"
fuck that. I'll live my little servile life as a cog in the machine as best I can, and then I'll die. and the dumb fucks who won't stop breeding while they try to make things worse for their children will repopulate the earth
bridgeenjoyer 21 points 10 months ago
No you don't understand. We're the most prosperous we've ever been at any point in time. There was literally no other time better than this. Life is wonderful in every way
/s
I'm generally a happy person but I hate people who say this.
Quetzalcutlass 4 points 10 months ago
I'm right there with you. They're basically saying "things could be worse, so there's no point in wanting them better." It's a nonsensical thought-terminating cliché.
outhouseperilous 3 points 10 months ago
No but you dont understand, the population is declining! It's so apocalyptic!
promitheas 2 points 10 months ago
This is how i feel as well. I understand im a cog in the machine, but i just want a relatively comfortable life until the sweet embrace of nothingness takes me in
tomiant 1 point 10 months ago
How this isn't obvious and something we should collectively want is beyond me. We really don't fucking need more than 8 billion people. I don't think we need more than 1, and even that is pushing it.
DrunkAnRoot 42 points 10 months ago
im not spending a fortune to raise a child when i can barely afford eggs
ur_ONLEY_freind 9 points 10 months ago
Don't worry when they get desperate enough they'll make condoms illegal
squaresinger 7 points 10 months ago
The math has changed.
100 years ago, you'd get kids so you can afford eggs.
Grostleton 4 points 10 months ago
Yeah, then child labor laws came and ruined that for everyone.
But don't worry, soon those too will be a thing of the past!
squaresinger 4 points 10 months ago
This, but also retirement being a thing.
100 years ago, kids were much less of an investment than today (they'd start pulling their own financial weight at like age 6-12, not at age 20-30 like today) and they'd be the only thing making the difference between being able to retire to one of your kids' home or the poor house.
Nowadays kids take much more money and time to get ready, and if you have no kids you can still retire and have your retirement financed by other peoples' kids. And then you even get to keep all the money you would have spent on getting your kids ready for the world, and you can spend it on yourself.
Financially speaking, having kids used to be a necessity and now it's a pretty bad choice.
Rooty 39 points 10 months ago
The birth rate moral panic is 100% manufactured by neoliberal capitalists who simultaneously want high consumption and low wages, which is a logical impossibilty. You cannot have a consumerist society where the average consumer lives paycheck to paycheck
tomiant 1 point 10 months ago
It's only because capitalism demands it. I am tired of people who think we need more people on this planet, we most certainly do not. There is nothing we can't do with 8 billion of us that we can do with 8 billion plus 1.
AlexLost -1 points 10 months ago
If it's neoliberalism, why is the right always clamouring about it? I think you are misguided on your aim my friend. You are also right, the time of us having things and enjoying our leisure are in the process of being erased for the good old days of company towns and food lines.
DrivebyHaiku 4 points 10 months ago
The "right" shy of outright fascists are neoliberals. The term was coined in the eighties and describes a system that like Liberalism classic works primarily off of an idea of a protected class of citizen (as opposed to lesser protected classes of non-citizen) with a series of fundemental "rights" to basic protected freedoms from government interference and choice of "style of life" based around a personal property centric system.
Where Neo-liberalism differs is it detests the welfare state, seeks widespread government deregulation as they see it as an economic deficit, practice widespread government austerity in public programs and seeks to privatize swaths of government services to create new market sectors.
Neo doesn't mean new in a "of the minute" kind of way. The people who came up with the distinction between liberal branches were describing the likes of Ronald Regan and Margret Thatcher.
trolololol -11 points 10 months ago path: 0 19017826 19018921, hotness: undefined, score: -11, children: 2
sunbrrnslapper 26 points 10 months ago
Dumb question: do we really need more people? It feels very much like technology/productivity will allow us to support a good lifestyle with fewer people.
gnutrino 29 points 10 months ago
The problem developed nations are currently facing is that we need enough young people working to continue to support the current population as it ages and retires. The absolute population probably doesn't need to be as big as it is (unless you plan on starting a war like Russia for example) but it's not clear how to manage a reducing population gracefully.
oxysis 12 points 10 months ago
Mhmm the uber wealthy have all the toys that the rest of the population could ever dream of. Taking away their extra ones allows you to pay for everyone else to get the level of care they deserve. Even then you will have an absurd amount of surplus that can be used to pay for decades of services that the general population needs while still letting the rich have some of their toys.
frunch 16 points 10 months ago
To me, that's the most disgusting part: they could live the most lavish lifestyle possible and not put a dent in their savings.
Nobody deserves that kind of wealth, nor should any one person control that much wealth. All those billions they're sitting on are funds that should have been allocated for better education, healthcare, transportation improvements and upgrades, affordable housing, etc.
outhouseperilous 0 points 10 months ago
What if we, instead if taking their toys, just voted for them?
They are a menace. They have ruined our earth and stolen our futures. They should lose everything. Fuck compromise; you'd have to fight just as hard for it; just take all of it. Vote for them all. Vote for their vile spawn too. Put them all in elected office.
outhouseperilous 1 point 10 months ago
No fuck that shit. Vote for the rich. Vote for their families. Vote for the fuckers who brutalize us on their behalf.
sunbrrnslapper 3 points 10 months ago
I think it is worth figuring out how to manage it - the alternative isn't super sustainable. The other thing is that it is like a 50 year challenge, which isn't insurmountable.
outhouseperilous 12 points 10 months ago
We? No. Capitalism? Yes.
AA5B 10 points 10 months ago
It’s only a dumb question if you’re looking at all the people now. Birth rates across the board are declining and most developed countries are well below replacement. We’re just not noticing yet because people live like 80 years.
Most population projections have us peaking in 25-50 years, then population declines. That’s not all bad but how steeply does population decline and when does it stop? How does it impact economies, politics, who had influence and power. It looks like it could be steep and disruptive, with no prediction on when it will level off.
However if we start mitigating that, start encouraging people to have children, provide more support for raising children, give more hope to potential parents, working together for a brighter future consistently for the next 50 years perhaps we can manage the decline for least disruption. Perhaps we can find a sustainable population to level off at which is still big enough for today’s rapid advancements
cattywampas 3 points 10 months ago
We need some more people. Much as I agree as the future is bleak, if we all simply stopped procreating then there wouldn't really be any point to anything and truly no reason to want to make the world better. Can't get to Star Trek future without a future.
sunbrrnslapper 4 points 10 months ago
I don't think I mean a complete stop. I mean like a managed approach of tax incentives that over time encourage smaller families. Predicting and paying for degrees or training so we have a workforce that can fit into the economy easily. And a targeted immigration policy scaled to supplement gaps in the workforce or population.
unconsequential 6 points 10 months ago
Most places are actually experiencing a birth rate decline. South Korea is having statistically less than one child per woman. Other places like Europe are also projected to shrink.
So, it’s already happening, that’s why countries are freaking out and trying to force births now. The policy shift in the US on abortion isn’t based on religion, it’s economics.
US birth rate hit 1.6, a “stable” birth rate is just over 2.1… mind you that’s the estimate for a population not growing or declining.
abbiistabbii 25 points 10 months ago
I mean you're half right. In a zoo, the keepers care for their animals, making sure they're well fed, enriched, and healthy.
We're being farmed. They are using us to make money from our produce (labour). They're using us to make money. We're so over exploited we simply cannot afford to have children.
TrollTrollrolllol 1 point 10 months ago path: 0 19027083 19038035, hotness: undefined, score: 1, children: 0
agamemnonymous 24 points 10 months ago
I want biological kids, and I'm right about the point in my life where it would make the most sense to have them. But whenever family asks about it, I tell them I'm not raising children in this kind of administration. They try to suggest that it's not that bad and I stand firm that they're not seeing grandbabies until the government stops being so fashy.
Actually, millennials could probably hold our hypothetical babies hostage, see what's more important to them.
UnderpantsWeevil 22 points 10 months ago
Actually, millennials could probably hold our hypothetical babies hostage
Given how many kids are in some combination of foster systems, detention centers, corrections programs, or concentration camps, maybe millennials need to start finding the actual babies and liberating them.
AnarchistArtificer 16 points 10 months ago
I directly know multiple people who had to get what were effectively late term abortions due to pregnancy complications that would've put their lives at risk otherwise. We don't live in the US, so they were fortunate to be able to get the medical care they needed, but it underscores the scariness of the situation in the US; these risks mean that becoming pregnant in the wrong place could literally be a life or death matter. If treatment is received, even people who experience severe complications may be able to have a successful pregnancy in future. Not having access to these things risks breaking the biological clock anyway, so waiting is not unreasonable.
squaresinger 2 points 10 months ago
The biological clock exists, and it is real. But it ends at a time where no reasonable person should seriously consider having a first child.
For most women menopause starts around 45 and the last period happens around 49-55. That's the hard limit.
Between 30-45 having kids is most often possible, though it's getting more difficult and the chance for things like trisomy 21 is increasing exponentially with increasing age.
unconsequential 17 points 10 months ago
Elon, that’s enough. Go home.
outhouseperilous 3 points 10 months ago
Oh! Could we keep it in my thigh? I want a fun new conversation piece!
droans 17 points 10 months ago
A man must always live by his work, and his wages must at least be sufficient to maintain him. They must even upon most occasions be somewhat more; otherwise it would be impossible for him to bring up a family, and the race of such workmen could not last beyond the first generation...
Every species of animals naturally multiplies in proportion to the means of their subsistence, and no species can ever multiply beyond it. But in civilised society it is only among the inferior ranks of people that the scantiness of subsistence can set limits to the further multiplication of the human species; and it can do so in no other way than by destroying a great part of the children which their fruitful marriages produce.
The liberal reward of labour, by enabling them to provide better for their children, and consequently to bring up a greater number, naturally tends to widen and extend those limits. It deserves to be remarked, too, that it necessarily does this as nearly as possible in the proportion which the demand for labour requires. If this demand is continually increasing, the reward of labour must necessarily encourage in such a manner the marriage and multiplication of labourers, as may enable them to supply that continually increasing demand by a continually increasing population.
- Adam Smith, the father of capitalism
oppy1984 13 points 10 months ago
Born in 84, I've noticed something of a trend in my area. Late gen X and late millennials are having children, most are having two or three, but a lot of people like me born in the mid 80's aren't. While this is by no means universal, there does seem to be more people within five years of my age going without kids.
rob_t_firefly 12 points 10 months ago
I love this person's glasses.
gingersaffronapricat 1 point 10 months ago
Ok. But what is the mouth
SoftestSapphic 9 points 10 months ago
I wish I could feel comfortable bringing children into the world.
I really want to be a parent in my life
toad31 6 points 10 months ago
I don't want to bring kids in this world that will inevitably grow up with a father when I take out all my frustration and grievances on members of the ruling class.
They're gonna wish I used a guillotine.
HurricaneLiz 4 points 10 months ago
Proud owner of a tubal litigation here
dream_weasel 0 points 10 months ago
Frames like that are excellent birth control.
rob_t_firefly 3 points 10 months ago
Nah, those frames are awesome.
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Want higher birthrates? Just convince people that tomorrow will be better than today.
That's how you see a spike in birth rates.
To maintain a steady birthrate, just convince potential parents that the world will not be any worse for their children than it is today.
See, easy.
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