Sorry, but I’m bringing my iced coffee to the job interview
6 days ago by lIlIlIlIlIlIl to c/nottheonion
I am a hiring manager for a small engineering team. I don't think I would notice as long as there wasn't extra attention drawn to the drink for some reason.
It's a stupid reason to not hire someone, it's a stupid reason to not get hired. Best to avoid the whole thing. People are so worried about how they should be able to do whatever they want, but people have been passed over for less. If you can afford to miss out on a job, go nuts.
as long as there wasn't extra attention drawn to the drink for some reason
If you accidentally spill coffee everywhere, you've just brought a lot of extra attention to it. Best not to risk it.
as someone who has also been involved hiring for engi roles
i would give zero shits, long as the person was pleasant in resolving the accident
if anything being able to see their behaivor under stress is a good thing
As an engineer, if you were offered drinks and you ask for decaf coffee, you'd probably get judged more than if it was just water. And this is coming from someone that drinks a fair bit of decaf
Having needed to hire for engineering teams, I think the iced coffee would be a big deal if the position was client facing and wouldn't be if it was internal.
The answer for me of "who defines professionalism" is the client. If the effective end client is me, I don't care. I'm pretty lax and chill.
However, if I'm hiring for a client facing role and you bring an iced coffee, you are saying that you don't know or don't care about client expectations and that is a red flag. I work in an industry where it is still the expectation to wear a suit and tie to certain client meetings. If you can't play the game with me, how can I trust you to play the game with the client?
Dress codes like that are racist. As a Native American I should be allowed to have my hair and clothing in a traditionally Cherokee style if I want to and if your clients have a problem with that then they are racist fucks who can go fuck themselves.
At the end of the day “the customer is always right” doesn’t mean I should be expected to sell my scruples for your ROI.
I wasn't talking about hair? I feel like we're starting to mix appearance requirements with non-appearance presentation.
And I don't care about hair other than it would be considered "neat" in the culture it came from. Given the multicultural mix of where I work, people wear a wide variety of different hair styles including afros, turbans, beards, and marks on their forehead. Even worked with a non-federally recognized Native American engineer who wore his hair long in a ponytail.
You mean the client expectations which were created last week over a fake social media controversy by people who literally have nothing better to do than shitpost on LinkedIn? Sorry we do enough actual work that we aren't up on LinkedIn meta.
Brother, I promise you I can sell a customer on the idea that we are just that fucking good, that our iced coffee rebellion is exactly what they are looking for. Because we actually are very fucking good at what we do.
You mean the client expectations which were created last week over a fake social media controversy by people who literally have nothing better to do than shitpost on LinkedIn?
No. I just know to not being a drink into a client meeting. Throw it out beforehand.
Brother, I promise you...
People promise things all the time.
Same. I am going to start talking about how much I fucking love iced coffee in phone screens from now on.
If some HR fuckwit wants to make this a thing then I will allocate a solid portion of my smug to it.
Can't break the stupid norms if we just keep confirming to them. I used to think I was born too late, but the older I get the more I realize I am way more fit for this current generation. They managed to rally the masses I never could.
The employer is also risking their chance to hire me.
I agree with all that, but I'd say a hot coffee avoids all of that. It won't leave a ring, there's no noisy ice you might chew on, and it's sipped slowly, so it's not very distracting. Just don't slurp, or leave it behind.
It's wild to say that drinking something will make you look bad to an interviewer. It's even more wild to write paragraphs of text defending it.
Never said I defended it, in fact first thing I said was that you should be able to. I said I've played the game for a long time and have learned the arbitrary rules, and honestly do pretty well in interviews. Feel free to do whatever you want, as I said to others, it's your job prospects, not mine.
I have twelve years of experience working at a bunch of different companies. I'll be okay.
The "honestly ask questions about the organization during the interview" advice is such bullshit. Your questions can and will be used against you. If you are sniffing around after a toxic work culture, a toxic work culture will sniff that out and reject you.
It reminds me of all the straight men who read a gay sex columnists advice about the importance of communication in a relationship then think its OK to ask their wife how they would feel about a three-way with her sister.
Depends on your preferences.
Do you like to sleep inside and eat food you bought at the grocery story?
or
do you enoy waking up in the outdoors and finding breakfast in the dumpster behind Dunkin Donuts?
But you make a good point. If I'm going to work in a toxic environment, I might as well not risk not working in a toxic environment by pretending I won't work in a toxic work environment.
You're just suggesting preemptive compliance. Go ahead and bend over backwards for the first employer to give you a few minutes of attention. The same one that will give you the boot the second they smell a hint of dissatisfaction with your shit pay and toxic work environment.
Your questions can and will be used against you. If you are sniffing around after a toxic work culture, a toxic work culture will sniff that out and reject you.
Sounds like a win to me. I don't see the problem.
then think its OK to ask their wife how they would feel about a three-way with her sister.
But some questions need to be answered dagnamit!
then think its OK to ask their wife how they would feel about a three-way with her sister.
I can never understand how relationships are supposed to function at all if one person would take issue with honest communication. That's not a relationship I would want to be in. But idk, maybe I just don't understand straight people.
Well, this is from a straight male perspective and the issue here is a straight women, so maybe it's the blind leading the blind, but basically straight women want to be the only woman their male partner is interested in and anything that threatens that is extremely destabilizing. Confessing you want to fuck her sister, someone who is in your life and very possibly available, and also very possibly a relational threat (because there's a lot of commonality already), would be planting a seed of doubt in her mind. On top of that, because the damage is obvious, such a question raises the possibility that the male partner is either cruel or callous or inconsiderate or really desperate to sleep with the sister.
Anyway, it's good that this is an old comment, because someone argue that women can be just as sexually free and promiscuous as men, to which I say, yes, absolutely they can and it's fine if they are, but they're much less likely to be.
Yeah, I mean, I'm a queer polyamorous woman so very much in a different world (perhaps within your "much less likely" category :p). I do see where you're coming from; I guess there is a difference between being honest if asked something like "do you want to fuck my sister?" (maybe stupid question to ask if a yes would be hurtful, but imo very important to not lie), and your original example of asking carelessly and unprompted if it would be okay to do so, which does raise a lot of questions as you say.
I do think it's fundamentally unrealistic even within monogamy to expect your partner to never be interested in anyone else, but probably realistic to expect them not to take steps towards being with someone else without a very careful conversation first. And that conversation is much better done before there is any particular person in mind, otherwise it can come across as "I want to date this other person more than you, but also I like the security of this relationship" etc etc.
I legitimately cannot conceive of any situation where I would care what kind of drink a candidate brought with them. All I care about is that you make the right shapes on the white board and don't give Trump supporter.
I get recruited a lot and occasionally agree to do an interview just to stay on my toes, and I am 100% going to bring a mega-gulp sized ice coffee, and wear a tshirt that says "Iced coffee fan" the next time I do this.
Actually I might order catered iced coffee for the entire office.
…if I have to slow down or stop for you to keep up you’re probably not getting the job, we’re a super fast paced physical department…
Congrats; you just got your company sued for discrimination under the ADA.
Whatever you bring is part of your "costume" for the interview. This is true for your clothes, any binder or notepad you bring, and yes even a drink. It all gets measured (even if subconsciously) against the company culture and job requirements. For customer-facing roles, where an iced coffee would be inappropriate, it's probably a bad idea to bring one.
One thing that other commenters (and the article) are missing is they are making the assumption that an interview is one-way. That you truly want the job, and you're just doing whatever it takes to get there. And if you're unemployed/desperate, that might be the case.
But if you're interviewing them as well, it's really important to locate the bullshit right away. If you won't be a good fit, getting the job will be bad for everyone. This is especially true if you're leaving a decent job elsewhere. If an iced coffee is a deal breaker, is that the culture you want to step into?
I've seen places that refuse to hire men with long hair, regardless of style. You can imagine what the rest of the culture is like. Going in with long (professional-looking) hair can bring out the problems faster and in a way that no other interview tactic would. Getting rejected here is dodging a bullet. Same with a coffee.
Oh yeah, long hair. I wear mine in a braid at work, down to my lower back. I had a job that I was hired for, met all the requirements but someone fairly high up saw my hair and was like "Nope, let him go, men don't have long hair." The guy who hired me told him "Ok, seeing as I hired him and YOU want him gone YOU can pay him 6 months salary, for no work, and he's gone today." Kept that job for 5 years, the higher up that wanted me gone? Gone that summer, 3 months after I started.
I'm glad somebody else understands this. Normies are so fucking easy to game because they often care more about appearances over anything else. Just gotta put on a good costume and play their game against them.
I dream of the day we get over this stupid lust of appearances and start focusing more on actual value and abilities. Anybody can get dressed in the morning, not anybody can do what I do when it comes to work and abilities.
Why can't you have iced coffee in front of a customer? I am not primarily customer facing but do a lot of integration and onboarding work in the field and have brought way weirder things to customer sites. Like a whole gallon of tea, and a six pack to put in their fridge for later.
Nobody - and I cannot stress this enough - fucking cares. Unless the job is some fake corporate butt sniffing gig where none of the people involved actually do any real work.
I would never bring food or drink to a job interview.
However, the debate has been distorted and a bit strawman'd. The original question was "would you bring an iced coffee to an interview for a Fortune 500 job?"
I'd agree that most interviewers probably wouldn't care but also most interviews are not for Fortune 500 companies.
also working for fortune 500 companies is extremely overrated anyway
strawman'd
Straw-manned. Apostrophes are going extinct from over-hunting and misuse.
''''''
Here have a few, I've got a captive breeding population going.
Emphasis on captive.
|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|”|
It's fine we'll just turn some hyphens sideways.
No, I've got a guy who can easily get me that kind of stuff. Semicolons, demicolons, tax-free umlauts, sawed-off em dashes. It's all available for a paltry sum, just don't ask him how he gets his stuff.
Does the fact that the coffee is iced have anything to do with your decision? Would you bring hot coffee to an interview?
No and no.
I interview candidates several times per year. I cannot imagine caring if they're drinking a coffee during the interview. I often am drinking coffee or water. We need competent people who are good collaborators. Paying attention to irrelevant nonsense would be shooting ourselves in the foot. I have to work with and rely on these people afterwards to get stuff done. If I miss out on a good person because I needed a power trip, I'm the one who suffers.
How dare the plebs drink.
Of course a drink of choice should be allowed. They are employing someone for their skill set. What they drink and when they drink it is irreverent (as long as its not alcohol or blood). Its just another control tactic, and tells you everything about the company.
This should not be a conversation for any org that appreciates understanding their talent, and the value of trust & motivation.
How many higher ups are hired at a fancy drink and a whisky or two. I bet the logic is not applied the same across all employees.
A little blood is ok for a night shift job or work-from-coffin.
I'm often hungry during rounds of interviews, so I like to bring a bucket of KFC.
As someone in a position to hire, I don't give a shit if you bring something to drink as long as it isn't booze. Show me you know your stuff and that's what really matters.
Bringing coffee in is a power move if you're employed already. It says "my time is just as valuable as yours and I intend to make the most of it regardless of what you think." As someone who just interviews to keep his skills sharp at this point, it's not the worst thing you can do so long as you don't make a big deal out of it.
I'd be more offended if they require you to prepare a slide deck of some useless example you probably made up anyway. That's working for free and I won't do it.
I've taken more than enough psychic damage from the arguments over this but I'm really glad this place has a smaller ratio of people blindly defending the arbitrary and superficial unspoken criteria of corporations when it comes to deciding who does/doesn't deserve to live.
It's bad enough living in a world where someone's dumb-ass incorrect perception of you can drastically make your life worse, but I especially don't want to live in a world where the working class not only accepts that but deliberately reinforces it. - Vire (vi/vim)
This place has a large portion of people who are here because they got tired of reddit's shit and wanted something better.
I think the type that thinks being arbitrary about this stuff is ok mostly stayed at reddit because they are used to accepting arbitrary shit.
And I think the type that defends this are either the bootlickers hoping to get brownie points for supporting the boss' arbitrary shit (or sometimes the arbitrary shit they assume the boss supports), or they are the type that enjoys abusing any power they get to make arbitrary judgements, sometimes even hypocritically because they don't oppose the thing itself but are currently using it to lord over someone. The ones of those that are here are probably here because they were reddit mods and left after a power struggle with reddit admins and are doing similar shit here, though maybe not as extreme given that so many are only here after getting tired of power abuses.
Why blow it up at all? If it doesn't fit in with the company culture, just don't hire them. Making it a big deal, like yelling at the candidate simply reeks of corporate entitlement. Plus, are you really telling me yould reject the golden candidate if he or she is exhibiting some subjectively questionable personal judgement? Like turning away Gabe Newell because he didn't shave before the interview, or Steve Jobs because he didn't turn up in a tie? Really?
If you want to do the candidate a favor, maybe tell them on the way out, and if their behaviour is so repulsive, they'll eventually get the idea and adjust, or find a company to which they are a better fit.
"Fitting into a company culture" is an enormous barge-sized excuse to practice every form of discrimination.
Might be more loke turning away Steve Jobs because he doesn’t shower and stinks.
I think it depends on the situation. My interviews typically lasted all day. Lunch was included and I believe at least once I was actually offered coffee. Personally I wouldn't bring mine. I don't consider it a burden to go without for one interview. Plus I usually had some kind of notebook with me with examples of my work and a copy of the interview schedule that was provided to me as well as other documentation. It all becomes a bit too much to carry if you add coffee. But if it's a more casual atmosphere, no biggie. I mean, I wouldn't likely show up in a suit for a job at the Mc Donald's drive-thru.
On the other hand how does the coffee drinker act. Is this person placing a sweaty drink container on the interviewer's desk? Slurping loudly during an interview question?
So I think it's situation dependent.
8h of interview? New age torture chamber?
I'm an engineer. Typically I interviewed with various disciplines and bosses. Lunch was usually a softball interview to make a candidate more comfortable. The last interview I had, I was considered a high value interviewee (not sure if I deserved that) but it meant I was asked to give a presentation during lunch. It can be pretty brutal honestly. Some places are worse than others. I heard that Google and Agilent would sometimes ask candidates to solve equations. There's no way I could perform like that in front of people.
To bring it back to the topic, I do think it would be a bad look to bring in a Starbucks to the interview.
In my previous job, we interviewed people for several positions, usually 4 to 6. Each area was looking for different things, so multiple interviews made sense, then it was up to each area if they wanted to make an offer. We'd include break for lunch and get non-managers to take them for lunch so they could chat. So not one 8h interview, several one hour interviews. This is pretty common with large organizations.
I had all-day interviews for my job too, including lunch. For me, they were already pretty sure I was the right person to hire, so it was only the one round of interviews. I was even a few minutes late due to my employer having several buildings and the one the interviews started in was unmarked. I showed up early to the wrong location.
That being said, while a single round of all-day interviews isn't bad, it would really suck if you had to do that multiple times, and would likely be a waste of time for everyone involved
wouldn't likely show up in a suit for a job at the Mc Donald's drive-thru.
Aaaand that's why you didn't get the job
/s
LOL. I like your moxie.
You can't bring coffee or drinks of any kind into a cleanroom environment so bringing one during the interview says to me nothing because if you get the job you're still not bringing coffee into the cleanroom. You can drink it outside and you can vape and smoke and get a tattoo in between your ball sack or buttcheeks but none of that will ever be done in a cleanroom environment. "One" other thing you are not allowed to do in a cleanroom is wear hair spray or aromatic aerosols or perfumes or makeup or clothing that sheds, or play loud music or wear your headphones or wear baggy clothes or not shower or bring your shoes or spit, pee or poo. But you can do all those one things outside. There are rules for every job and the rules may prohibit you from doing things you would otherwise do. Like doctors don't drink coffee during a surgery right over the open cavity. I'm not sure if a doctor may be allowed coffee on a table nearby. I'm not a doctor, so I don't know. A car mechanic could probably be allowed to drink coffee or other drinks while working on a car. A stunt pilot cannot be driving coffee during flight. A racecar driver also cannot drink coffee from a coffee cup while driving during a race. They might be able to drink from a helmet straw. So in sort I don't care what you drink during an interview.
My last job had nitro cold brew on tap and we offered it to the candidates because we want them to want the job. That's what it really comes down to: is the employer competing for candidates or is the candidate competing for jobs. Where does the power lie. That's all that matters.
For the companies that mind you bringing an iced coffee, you should be glad if they reject you. If that is part of their criteria, they probably aren't someone you would want to work for. I didn't like the people who were obviously putting on an act to try to be what they thought I wanted them to be during the hiring process. Culture fit is important. Two people with the same skills will not be equal candidates if one is contrary to the rest of the employment group. Also someone who will not fit in will not be able to fully use their skills due to social conflicts. Soft skills matter more in some positions/companies than others.
Wow, crazy how article went from "iced coffee" to "everything is racist and white people are evil."
How about don't bring ANY drinks to the interview, except maybe water.
No it has nothing to do with racism, psycho author.
No it has nothing to do with racism, psycho author.
No, they have a point. Historically a lot of these norms were established for that purpose, just like the origin of homeowners associations. You'd be surprised by how much is there if you dig down further.
Plus, as others have pointed out here there's plenty of jobs where nitpicking like this is detrimental due to passing on skilled workers for a dumb reason
That being said, holy shit that pivot was too hard. The abruptness just detracts from their point
Am I missing something here, or does the whole iced coffee thing not just amount to the question of whether you should take food or drink to an interview?
If someone brings a half eaten big mac to an interview, that's not creating the best impression. It doesn't suggest they are taking the interview very seriously. Same goes for iced coffee, popcorn, red bull or whatever. You could make the case that some "professionalism" norms are inherently racist (no doubt they are mostly arbitrary rules made up by white men), but I'm at a loss as to how this particular one might be. It is just that we should do away with the whole concept of professionalism and just say anything goes in the workplace? I'm not convinced that would go well.
EDIT: Just for clarity I'm not saying it should be a deal breaker either. Only that you could reasonably expect to make a better impression without an iced coffee than with one.
You must be a white dude
Wow I could never imagine bringing iced coffee to an interview. Why? Because coffee makes me need to poop like immediately. If I need to rush out mid interview because I might shit my pants, I'm probably not going tk get the job.
About 10-3 years back I've had an interview about every year - I've been a contractor, working from home, as a developer, and each time I've been recruited into a new round of contractors that were let go at the end of the year (had nothing to do with skill). I've worked from home, and I smoke shisha, so naturally I usually had one going after lunch, which is where most interviews took place. I've even eaten lunch during some. Apart from a few times being told - one recruiter said if I know they are vegan lol - nobody really minded. I've been accepted on more than I haven't.
Of course, I've had a highly paid job, and I don't think anyone minded that I do something at my own house.
if that is my company, i'm not hiring you if you bring starbucks iced coffee. that's not because i don't like iced coffee, but because you clearly lack a brain. who would pay $8 for that overpriced stuff.
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We're not The Onion! Not affiliated with them in any way! Not operated by them in any way! All the news here is real!
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Ha, I've been following this whole thing and it's just so funny to me. It's such a younger generation thing, maybe I'm older and so I've just "played the game" a lot. The whole thing is should you be able to take your drink of choice? Of course! However, would I do that? Hell freaking no I wouldn't.
Going into an interview from the first glance they're judging you to see if you're a good fit. Granted you're also judging them but let's be honest, it's pretty lopsided. If I go in I want them to see my best foot forward, it means I'm putting on a show for the next hour (or more nowadays) so that you want to hire me. I'm not bringing in anything that alters that view of me. Iced coffee, hot coffee, nothing. Maybe a neat folder of a couple spare resumes and a notebook I can take notes in. I plan ahead, I'll usually be at a coffee shop before the interview anyway (it helps make sure I'm there on time, get there 30-60 mins ahead of time and chill at a coffee shop), and then walk over for the interview.
Bringing a drink or anything extra is just something that now they're thinking about, and you don't want them thinking about you in that way. It's something else that you put on the table, you're taking sips of, for cold drinks it's condensing and leaving a ring, and then you have to ask for a trash. All benign things but again, you're in their house and why would you want to bring any negative attention at all to them? I've had interviewers who were obviously just having bad days say no to me for arbitrary bullshit already, why add to that? It all seems like an unnecessary gamble for no reason at all.
Now if they offer coffee or a drink when you get there (hopefully they do) I'm all for it. They offered, it's free game. Go wild. Just don't get picky.
I know this is a wall of text but I'll also say that as an interviewer I don't care at all if they do, as long as they're professional and it doesn't get in the way. If it's distracting, you're shaking the ice, or slurping out the last bits, or whatever, yeah it's going to distract me. I'm not going to be annoyed because you brought coffee, but I will be annoyed if you aren't appearing to take an interview seriously.
And now unfortunately bringing it after this whole social media thing is basically wearing a target on your... front? face? that says "I'm making a statement" and will absolutely label you a troublemaker to any HR person (because you know every HR person has seen this). It's also probably tainted it for 5-10 years as they'll keep remembering this.
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